an odd concept for people "faith"

[himura hatake]

how manypeople these days have lost faith and not just to their dieties but to each other and to goverments the world is ending for loss of faith kinda sad if faith is lost then what hope of utopia do we have.....?  

[Super Perfundo]

First, please learn how to use punctuation.

Second, Utopia is an idealist fantasy that could never possible occur.

Third, faith is for people who have nothing better to do. There's no time for it in this fast-paced world.  

[Durrypoo Ov Fire]

Super Perfundo

Third, faith is for people who have nothing better to do. There's no time for it in this fast-paced world.

I have to strongly disagree with this. Faith goes beyond religion, faith includes all kind of personal beliefs. There is place for it in this world: being optimistic about how situations we can control is a matter of faith, believing in ourselves being able to win at a certain competition is also a matter of faith, trusting in our friends being true is also a matter of faith. Also, religious faith(I'm assuming you reffered to it in your reply) is not for people who have nothing better to do, some people are very hard working, or very good persons because their religious faiths tell them to be that way. I'm not religious, but I'm a person who lives with faith.  

[Super Perfundo]

durrypoo

Super Perfundo

Third, faith is for people who have nothing better to do. There's no time for it in this fast-paced world.

I have to strongly disagree with this. Faith goes beyond religion, faith includes all kind of personal beliefs. There is place for it in this world: being optimistic about how situations we can control is a matter of faith, believing in ourselves being able to win at a certain competition is also a matter of faith, trusting in our friends being true is also a matter of faith. Also, religious faith(I'm assuming you reffered to it in your reply) is not for people who have nothing better to do, some people are very hard working, or very good persons because their religious faiths tell them to be that way. I'm not religious, but I'm a person who lives with faith.

I'm sorry. I should have clarified. I was talking about religious faith. I had just had a discussion on religious faith with a coworker not long before writing that, so that's what I was thinking of. The way I see it, people just don't have enough time to sit around and create holy moments. The world isn't some bright, shiny God-filled orb, people have to sit around and use their faith to make it that way. The world is air-pollution and midday traffic and apartment complexes. No faith necessary. I have faith that my manager will give me a hard time at work. That's about it.  

[Totle]

I seem to wavering in faith due to my sudden realization of how hypocritical Christianity is. I can't speak for other religions, because I'm ignorant about them. I have a problem with how, we're preached and lectured to be good honest Christians, and then we get to go to Heaven. That's great, but isn't that simple bribing us to be good? Doesn't that mean that we're good only to get into Heaven not because we genuinly are good natured? On top of that, what exactly is Heaven? A place where all you want you get... that's fine but you're going to get tired of that... real soon. And you have to stay there for what... like forever? What can we clearly define as Heaven?  

[nightlight]

You're thinking in conventional terms. According to whatever, what happens at death is that you shed your mortal shell and are no longer bound by anything your body ever needed. No hunger, no boredom, no WANT of any sort. So no, you aren't supposed to get bored of heaven or anything.

A way to think about all this and avoid whatever problems you have is that you can think about living your life in a rightful manner *in spite* of the fact that you should 'get into heaven' when you die. just do it because you just should, that's all.  

[Existence of Self]

First of all, this is a biased opinion. By saying that lack of faith will lead to lack of Utopia, you're expressing belief that faith brings peace.

Now, onto the subject at hand. First of all, there is a very few percentage of people who have lost faith in their religion. Also, if you didn't have that faith, wouldn't you no longer be of that religion?

Secondly, loss of faith in the government isn't neccessarily a bad thing. Last time I checked, it was the different beliefs of the different governments that were causing most of the wars in the world. If we abolished the government, people would no longer have to fight.

And lastly, what has faith ever had to do with Utopia? Utopia is a place in which all people in it live in harmony and unity. That doesn't mean that they have to have the same beliefs.  

[Durrypoo Ov Fire]

GeoSyoledar

And lastly, what has faith ever had to do with Utopia? Utopia is a place in which all people in it live in harmony and unity. That doesn't mean that they have to have the same beliefs.

Utopia is not a place, it is a plan or ideal that could not happen in reality... also, please watch the words you guys chose to reply, some of the replies here sound like you were bashing him, I know it might not be your intention, but it really gives that impression. neutral  

[Super Perfundo]

What he's saying makes no sense. It's not bashing him personally, just the topic he has laid out.

I just managed to decipher a part of the original topic starter and it says that the world is ending due to loss of faith...?? What? Has God decided to suck the earth back into his womb because there are a few less religious fanatics? If the world is ending, it's due to global warming, nuclear production, lack of fossil fuels, lack of an ozone layer, etc. It's got nothing to do with faith or a lack thereof.

Faith is a superfluous word that I think people use too freely these days.  

[Durrypoo Ov Fire]

Super Perfundo

I just managed to decipher a part of the original topic starter and it says that the world is ending due to loss of faith...?? What? Has God decided to suck the earth back into his womb because there are a few less religious fanatics?

that would totally suck, but assuming he really gave us life to whorship him I guess he would be in his right to take away our lives because we are not doing "our work" confused

Super Perfundo

If the world is ending, it's due to global warming, nuclear production, lack of fossil fuels, lack of an ozone layer, etc. It's got nothing to do with faith or a lack thereof.

Now I think I got his point about this loss of faith messing up with the world(humanity perhaps was what he referred to as world), since now I sit and think properly, most of my friends have no faith in people, they believe that good people never get far and only if you got the right contacts and the money you can get to be something, I guess it's destroying human morality and ethics more recently to follow the basic rules for a more fair society.  

[Existence of Self]

durrypoo

GeoSyoledar

And lastly, what has faith ever had to do with Utopia? Utopia is a place in which all people in it live in harmony and unity. That doesn't mean that they have to have the same beliefs.

Utopia is not a place, it is a plan or ideal that could not happen in reality... also, please watch the words you guys chose to reply, some of the replies here sound like you were bashing him, I know it might not be your intention, but it really gives that impression. neutral

I assumed you meant Utopia in the literal sense. I apologize. But either way, my theories stand.  

[Ralelend]

(Apologies in advance for what I'm sure is going to be a rather rambly post. smile )

From what I understand utopia isn't a plan for a society, it is a vision, idea, or concept of a society completely devoid of any of life's problems, and completely devoid of anything resembling a plan grounded in reality. I don't believe in utopia.

I am a Christian. I don't want to get all evangelical. I don't believe in evangelism. I just want to offer my point of view as far as where I'm coming from and why I believe what I do. I was raised Catholic, but have since converted to Congregationalism and am now going to a UCC church. My husband is an atheist. WRT Totle's post, I agree that there are a number of Christians that try to be good and moral simply because they want to get into heaven. I abhor this approach to Christianity, because it is selfish and treats others as a means to an end. (So of course I would also argue that Pascal's wager is worthless trite.) Anyways, I don't believe this is the case for all Christians, and I don't follow it myself. I have far more respect for moral atheists like my husband than for those who are just trying to rake up points to get into heaven.

Also, I don't sit around waiting for "holy moments," or whatever you want to call them. I spend time in prayer and reflection, but most of the time I am caught up in the routines of life that we all are caught up in. I'm also strongly influenced by Buddhism, and I /try/ to be mindful of the present moment and live life meditatively. I'm also a Marxist-Humanist.

What this all boils down to for me is this: I have faith in the potential of humanity and hope for a new and better human society. Like I said, I don't believe in utopia. I think all societies will have issues. But I believe capitalism, racism, sexism, and heterosexism not only can but *must* be overcome. I am far too concerned with these issues to worry about what will happen to me after I die if I don't go to church or believe in God. (As it stands, I do go to church and believe in God, but that is for my own spiritual and emotional well-being. Again, I'm not out to convert anyone. I believe all people must find the path that is right for her or him.)  

[Mallorys Wedgie Friend]

if faith is something we believe in, because we feel that way, then would not the whole, entire world be based off of faith? Many years ago we had scientific theories that have now been disproved, but at that time those people had faith in the idea that that theory was true... we're all based off of faith.  

[Wirekittin the nefarious]

Personally, I believe that faith is something required to make us human. If we don't believe in anything, how can we make our own opinions?

And as many people have already stated: Unless you are alluding to More's Utopia, a Utopia as a place does not exist. It is impossible to have utopia because we all have different ideas of what tranquility would be. Muslim extremists believe that a world without anyone other than muslims would be perfect, but those who believe differently say no. The only way to have utopia is to have complete and absolute conformity, which is a strong oxymoron.  

[The Rogue Doll]

Existence of Self

Secondly, loss of faith in the government isn't neccessarily a bad thing. Last time I checked, it was the different beliefs of the different governments that were causing most of the wars in the world. If we abolished the government, people would no longer have to fight.

But they would. Even if they wouldn't have to they would. They would fight untill a new government was installed to control the fighting. Anarchy is a nice idea, but it involves personal responsibility, which the every day human cannot cope with .

(Sorry, nothing to say on the topic...)