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Biology Class Dissection. Goto Page: [] [<] 1 2 3 ... 4 5 [>] [»|]

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Cynnith

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:30 pm


I was lucky enough to goto a highschool that offered a non-disection class. You can ask if they have something like that for you. Saying that you morally object to disection may help your case.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:57 pm


I've refused to dissect everything but feces. Everyone else refused to dissect the feces.

The only thing I'd dissect is someone I don't like.

And that's only If I can use a hatchet.

Angels Are Mathematical


Taeryyn

Man-Hungry Ladykiller

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:48 am


arrow Did you refuse to dissect animals in biology? No. I would have received a fail for that part of the course. I could have fought it with the school-board, but quite frankly, it wasn't worth ruining the rest of my year at school. It would have meant a fight with the administration, and a considerably lower mark in the class.

arrow If you did refuse, did you try suggesting alternatives and succeed? Obviously not.

I took bio, twice. I don't remember what we dissected when, but we dissected worms twice, a star fish (the prof did it, we watched), and a fetal pig.

I don't know how the animals were obtained.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:23 am


Afflaetus
I can see why you would be against it, and I love my kitties too, but remember that it's necessary to learn.

To learn more about the human body, we dissect people too, eh? The local university here has a hard time getting body donars for the med students and scientists to look at. Now, when they look at the human body that way, the med students learn more, and we get advances in medicine that more than make up for the desecration of the bodies. Dissecting animals is no different (aside from the fact that you can't get their consent, but we don't have their consent to put a collar/leash on them, or bring them to the vet, either), so I hope that you're not morally against dissections, at least in the case of animals that have died naturally.

That being said, I hated doing dissections, but it was more the smell of preservative chemicals, but we only did giant grasshoppers, cutting up a cat would make me feel awful (biology isn't required here, I took physics instead).

You would be a terrible vet if you never do dissections. There is no better way to learn! Remember that being a vet involves cutting up animals to do surgeries, removing claws, removing reproductive organs (very invasive for females), as well as euthanizing, so you might want to rethink your career if you're too against any of these to do them.


Oh, and:
Did you refuse to dissect animals in biology?
No. It was just a grasshopper, though.

If you haven't taken biology, do you plan on refusing to dissect when the time comes?
Not taking biology.
Are you completely against dissection, only against certain animals being dissected (example: you'd dissect a worm but not a frog, cat, etc) or not against dissection at all?
I'm pro-dissecting, I just would rather someone else did the dissecting. I'm just too squeamish, you know?


I'm extremely surprised that you're comparing the study of human cadavers (which obviously were collected from people who died of other causes) to animal dissection, in which animals are very often raised and killed solely to be cut up by a thirteen-year-old.

I'm extremely surprised that you're comparing leashing an animal to killing it for dissection purposes. 'Nuff said there, I think.

"There is no better way to learn?" Name three parts of the insect you dissected that the general public wouldn't recognize and the importance of their function. When I opted out of my classroom dissections (yes, dissections - our Biology class dissected six different animals over a period of just a few months), I asked my friends what they'd done in class. Common response? "OMG, it was gross ... [body part] spilled out everywhere ... [classmate] made it twitch by poking its leg ... we thought it was a girl, but we couldn't find the organ or anything."

I watched a videotape of the SAME dissections. The video showed each dissection performed by a professional (generally on two animals - a male and a female). The professional, of course, was able to locate and describe all of the organs without mutilating the body too heavily. It was more educational than I can ever imagine it would be if it were my fellow teen dicing up the animals.

I'm sorry, but it just doesn't make sense to me... and your dissection seems infinitely more pointless than one on a cat. How often to vets operate on insects?

It should also be noted that in most cases, the animal bodies are purchased from a company (such as Carolina Biological Supply) that profits from raising and killing animals for the sole purpose of dissection. As with most other animal industries, abuse is not uncommon. I can certainly see how animals which have died of natural causes should be at least put to use to train vets, but I don't see how you can "hope" others aren't morally against the industry behind most dissections.

Electric Snowchicken


Afflaetus

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 11:27 am


zewl


I'm extremely surprised that you're comparing the study of human cadavers (which obviously were collected from people who died of other causes) to animal dissection, in which animals are very often raised and killed solely to be cut up by a thirteen-year-old.

I'm extremely surprised that you're comparing leashing an animal to killing it for dissection purposes. 'Nuff said there, I think.

"There is no better way to learn?" Name three parts of the insect you dissected that the general public wouldn't recognize and the importance of their function. When I opted out of my classroom dissections (yes, dissections - our Biology class dissected six different animals over a period of just a few months), I asked my friends what they'd done in class. Common response? "OMG, it was gross ... [body part] spilled out everywhere ... [classmate] made it twitch by poking its leg ... we thought it was a girl, but we couldn't find the organ or anything."

I watched a videotape of the SAME dissections. The video showed each dissection performed by a professional (generally on two animals - a male and a female). The professional, of course, was able to locate and describe all of the organs without mutilating the body too heavily. It was more educational than I can ever imagine it would be if it were my fellow teen dicing up the animals.

I'm sorry, but it just doesn't make sense to me... and your dissection seems infinitely more pointless than one on a cat. How often to vets operate on insects?

It should also be noted that in most cases, the animal bodies are purchased from a company (such as Carolina Biological Supply) that profits from raising and killing animals for the sole purpose of dissection. As with most other animal industries, abuse is not uncommon. I can certainly see how animals which have died of natural causes should be at least put to use to train vets, but I don't see how you can "hope" others aren't morally against the industry behind most dissections.


Indeed, my dissection was completely pointless. I agree with you totally. It was a grasshopper, for heaven's sake, and I could only see things better because it was so much larger than the ones we get here. That's grade nine science in Canada for you. A cat would have been much more educational.

Now, when you have immature thirteen year olds dissecting animals, of course it's going to be completely useless. Pretty much whatever they do is useless and a waste of materials. When you have serious students getting hands on experience and seeing things for themselves, I hold to my belief that they're going to learn something valuable.

And I still don't see how animal dissection isn't different from human dissection, aside from the aforementioned lack of consent on behalf of the animal, whose consent it would be impossible to obtain. If it's done properly, it's the same thing.

Watching a dissection on a video would be an excellent thing to do before doing it yourself. But there are certain things that it's hard to understand from video, certain textures and subtleties, how things feel more than how they look.

I don't really know too much about the supply industry, (I can make some assumptions though, thank you) so I can't be against it. It is dissection itself that I am advocating, and I'm sure there are means of obtaining specimens in a moral way. If there isn't, then I would say that the supply industry needs to change, but not be abolished, and neither should dissection.

The animal shelter (as well as local veterinarians) here euthanizes countless animals every year. I would not object to their bodies being used for something more purposeful than rotting away.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:31 pm


I got this horrid lab where we had to kill goldfish banned
but the teach said they didnt have the equitment to make it "more human"

The_Communist


Lupine Lazuli

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:40 pm


When the time comes, I'm refusing. No question about it.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:23 am


angoraphobia - when i was in seventh grade my class used the virtual frog. i was still eating meat at the time, but there was no way i was going to cut up a real one.

if you don't want to dissect an animal, you shouldn't have to. i don't think that the school is really going to give you a failing grade if you pressure them enough. there are lots of things you can do: you can claim it's against your beliefs (religious or moral), you can get help from a local animal rights group (they would be much more experienced and the school would be more likely to bow to a group than a student that they think they have dominion over), or you could just call your local news. schools are tax payer supported (and the private ones are funded by parents) so the prospect of looking bad on tv and pissing off the people that pay their bills really hits home. sometimes all it takes is one nine o'clock news report to get your way. also, you could just try to rally support at your school. you may be the only vegetarian, but you might be surprised at the amount of non-veggies that disagree with dissection. you'll probably get a lot of support from people that don't really care about the animal, but just think it's "icky". i certainly wouldn't have dissected a cat before i went vegan. then you have the lazy people that just don't want to do schoolwork... try asking around at your school and see how many others don't want to do it. even a small amount of people can create a hell of a stir.

greendale


spacekitten

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:36 pm


My highschool biology teacher told the class a few weeks before the planned frog dissection that if we objected to the dissection in anyway, we could let her know and she had several alternatives to the assignment. I chose to spend class in the library and label a diagram of a frog's innards. I think I had to write a short essay too, I don't remember.

They make computer programs nowadays that simulate dissection, and there is also a plastic dissectable-model thing floating around somewhere. A good biology teacher should fully understand your issues with dissection and offer a different assignment, as long as you talk to them ahead of time. If you're really unsure about talking to him/her, maybe you could type up a letter for them, fully explaining your objection in an educated way.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:11 pm


I was supposed to dissect a frog last year, but I refused! I just went up to the teacher and told her that it was against my moral principles, and she let me do a power point instead.

I am totally against this kind of dissection, where animals are born and raised on farms to be killed for dissection in schools (the frogs at our school were raised on farms for this purpose). The very concept I find to be extremely twisted and immoral. What's even more repulsive, the whole entire year, the dead frogs were sitting in boxes in the classroom just waiting to be cut.

I think you should just tell your teacher that you have humanitarian issues with animal dissection. Someone can't force you to do something against your moral beliefs!

Felice the Beast


whitewaterlilly13

PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:52 pm


~Moishi~
Several months in the future when I'm in a new grade and taking biology, this is bound show up at some point.

I haven't yet decided what I'm going to do about it, but I still have awhile to think of something. I'm completely against it, but I'm afraid my softspoken personality will prevent me from speaking up, especially since I'm the only vegetarian/animal rights advocate in school.

My questions to all of you are:

arrow Did you refuse to dissect animals in biology?

arrow If you did refuse, did you try suggesting alternatives and succeed?

arrow If you haven't taken biology, do you plan on refusing to dissect when the time comes?

arrow Are you completely against dissection, only against certain animals being dissected (example: you'd dissect a worm but not a frog, cat, etc) or not against dissection at all?

EDIT:: I am only completely against dissection if the animals were killed for the purpose of being sent to science classes. I will be more open to dissection if the animals died naturally. Although I admit I need hands-on experience to be a vet, it'll still be really hard for me to decide to dissect a cat. Seeing dead cats regardless of how they died saddens me.


I first refused to disscect animals, it is against my morals and better nature.... I had to do it on line of course but it was worth it....
PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:30 am


I did not refuse to dissect animals in any of my classes. I do think that alternatives should be given though. Alternatives were never mentioned in highschool even though there were people opposed to dissecting. I don't mind dissecting if the animal has died naturally. Our teachers told us that they were not killed for dissection. I don't know if that was true or not. I have dissected a cat, worm, hag fish, and a shark.

In my college zoology class we did not buy animals for dissection. What our assignment was, if you find a dead animal we could use it. A lot of animals that were hit by cars and left on the side of the road were what we used. Sorry if this sounds kind of sick.

Henbane
Vice Captain


Running with Scissors

PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:30 pm


Schools are required now to provide alternatives to dissection in science classes.

I'm not sure if it's upheld, but it IS there.

I actually know the guy who helped make it law. He refused to dissect something in science class (way back in the '60s) and took an F.

He eats meat though. >_>
PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 6:23 pm


I've dissected worms, and then piglets. I wasn't vegetarian at the time, but I felt so bad about it. I think we had the option of opting out of the dissecting pigs, mostly because some people get sick from the smell they've sat in to keep them, er, "pickled". (can't remember what it was).

It's odd to think that they've gave us that option though, because it was a small town/beef country. But my science teacher had said before we started, that we must show respect for the animal and only use it's body for research and studying. If he saw anyone taking the piglet and using it like a puppet (or anything really rude) he would send them out of the class.

But I still think schools should start opening up more virtual type dissections instead of real ones.

Schaala


Taeryyn

Man-Hungry Ladykiller

PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 9:15 pm


greendale


if you don't want to dissect an animal, you shouldn't have to. i don't think that the school is really going to give you a failing grade if you pressure them enough.

Unfortunately, my teacher really would have given me an Incomplete (which is essentially an F) for not doing the dissections.
Quote:

there are lots of things you can do: you can claim it's against your beliefs (religious or moral),

It isn't against my religion, and I feel that morals are best left out of school discussions. I don't want them forcing their "morals" on me, so I don't bring my morals against them in arguments.
Quote:

you can get help from a local animal rights group (they would be much more experienced and the school would be more likely to bow to a group than a student that they think they have dominion over),

Yes, assuming there was such a thing. Which there isn't.
Quote:

or you could just call your local news. schools are tax payer supported (and the private ones are funded by parents) so the prospect of looking bad on tv and pissing off the people that pay their bills really hits home. sometimes all it takes is one nine o'clock news report to get your way.

Our news is a 5 page weekly newspaper. One 200-student school in the middle of nowhere isn't going to make it on the nearest news, which serves a city over two hours away.
Quote:

also, you could just try to rally support at your school. you may be the only vegetarian, but you might be surprised at the amount of non-veggies that disagree with dissection. you'll probably get a lot of support from people that don't really care about the animal, but just think it's "icky".

I've seen rallies done before at my school, and they were a joke. More than half of the people participating did it for attention, and the administration knew it.
Not to mention that MY school doesn't decide what is in the curriculum. We have to fight just to get enough teachers to even offer a biology course.

Quote:
i certainly wouldn't have dissected a cat before i went vegan. then you have the lazy people that just don't want to do schoolwork... try asking around at your school and see how many others don't want to do it. even a small amount of people can create a hell of a stir.


I'm not going to use lazy people to back me up. In a small school, everyone knows who the slackers are, and they wouldn't help the fight a damn bit.
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Animal Rights

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