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You would have a ******** ball with my parents.


First off, Stalin was never the main proprietor of Communism, that was Lenin. Stalin followed in his footsteps and came swooping in with an iron first. Secondly, you think the leaders of that era gave a s**t about what America had to say? If they did, they wouldn't have begun to transform the entire political standpoint of the country.

Most importantly, you must note that Lenin was an exiled idividual. During WWI the Germans found it appropriate to send him back to stir things up. The monarchy was failing and the people were on edge, the perfect time to create the Bolsheviks and take over Russia. This just pulled another enemy out of the war.

Communism in itself is a Russian thing, because Marx's ideas were more of an anarchist utopia. Lenin took those ideas and applied it to a country who was in dire need of saving. He was clever, his propoganda was simple enough for any country or city person to understand. After he managed to seize power, all peoples were allowed to be Communists.

Fast forward a few years however and Jews are being kicked out and persecuted. All the land and possessions that had been distributed evenly is being repossessed and claimed as the governments so many are left with nothing. The whole concept of everyone is equal completely crumbles because the government begins to do what it would like. Those who hoped for a more structured and forgiving government are just faced with a new terror.

How can you possibly even think that Communism was something that actually worked well? In my opinion, there is no real debate, especially hearing about living in the Soviet Union first hand from my entire family. The government stole from its people and killed them. They persecuted almost everyone, and no one but the Communists owned anything of value. Food was scarce and rarely fresh. The availabilty of many things was basically nonexistant, and Jews especially had it the worst. They were only allowed to go to certain schools and take certain career paths only. My mother was the only Jew in her entire school and was greatly looked down upon for it.

During WWII while in America people snugly slept in their homes and had at least portioned food to eat people in the Soviet Union lived in holes on the ground. They had to grow their own food to survive. Russian soldiers went into battle with none of their own weapons and were told to pick up loaded weapons from the dead. What kind of country enters a war with no resources and willingly sends its people on death missions? Are you telling me you would risk your life for a country that has given you no rights and no freedom?

Your arguement is weak. There was a hostile international environment for a reason because any political leader with a shred of common sense knew that this type of government was going no where good. And many countries have enslaved others as satellites for many hundreds of years, perhaps not to the same degree, but it was a war and there are always buffer zones in major wars.

I apologize about the first comment, I misread your original post about Stalin. I know what kind of ruler the Czar was, don't worry you don't have to explain it to me. And I did mention that the revolution wasn't just because of the propoganda but because the people wanted the change too. That is what I meant by "on edge."

They would have listened to anyone who offered them peace, land, and bread (which btw was the main agenda of Lenin's propaganda, it was simple enough for all to understand and his intent was to reach mainly the farmers and poor). The people wanted change but they were also bewildered by Lenin's strong charisma and his faith in a new government. Why do you think the Bolsheviks were named so? Bolshoi means bigger in Russian, and Lenin had a bigger following than the monarchy. I'm sure you can guess why there were called the Menshaviks.

Communism was coined and created by the Russians. You said it yourself that Lenin based his ideas off of others, so all of those ideas together became Communism. But they weren't Communism when they were separate and being spoken of by different philosophers. Lenin also exaggerated the ideals of Marxism that he wanted and downplayed that of which he didn't need as much. Also, all modern countries follow Stalinistic Communism because he funded them to become Communist and they follow his model. The Soviets twisted the philosophers ideas to fit their own needs.

I never said such a thing that the Russian people were slaves with few priviledges. They had little to no opportunities, and Communism is extremely superficial. Many of the leaders under Communism only cared about power, land, and money. Now, Lenin was probably the best-natured of all these men I will admit. And I'm not denying that the Revolution set up all the things that you mentioned, because it did. After Lenin died though, Stalin did things his own way. I don't think three families living in a room the size of your living room probably was a decent house.

Jews were being persecuted all over Europe, but that doesn't make it any less valid, as you said of my point about satellite countries. Europe overall was anti-semetic and I am very aware of that.

Perhaps agriculture soared however, that doesn't mean that it was distributed fairly to the people. This was more in my grandmother's time though, during the early years of Communism. Maybe even a bit while my father was a child, but after that things got a somewhat better. My family wasn't alone in this, it was the entire city and towns surrounding. You are making it sound like my families experiences are invalid though, whose story would be valid in your eyes? They are Russians, they grew up in the Soviet Era. Are you saying that a first hand experience isn't worth something that you can find in a book or on the internet? I take a tiny bit offense to that.

Sure, Stalin did the best he could. And I have the utmost respect for those soldiers who were basically sent out to their death to protect the honor of their country. But, if Stalin had done things differently he may have had weapons to give to his soldiers and maybe the losses wouldn't have been as major. The Soviet Union paid the war in blood, not iron like everyone else. I never spoke of the actual war, I was just stating that in my personal opinion it was wrong to send men out like that. You are right though, they had no choice but to go.

Russia only became the second world power because of fear and weapons, not because of political integrity. Plus, even currently Russia is full of the extremely poor who are basically on the level of peasants. The cities have developed, but the countryside hasn't.

We are not having a "who is right" discussion. We are having a debate, and we just so happen to be on opposing sides. That doesn't mean you have to be rude, which you are in quite a few instances. My opinions aren't solely based off of what I have heard, there are still facts and history thrown into there. And, I just so happen to agree with these "biased" opinions because they come from people who have lived it first hand. Are you telling me that my entire family and many other Russians that I have spoken to are lying? That these are just bad instances? I would say that they are examples of a country in turmoil.

sigh i am lazy to continue debating about this
but i will say


i said that lenin's followers were the bolsheviks, not the menshaviks
most of the people who agreed with his ideas didn't know anything else


perhaps we were both being a little rude then
sorry ~