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so i was wondering about the "time war" that wiped out all of the time lords referred to in the new series. i thought it was supposed to be in the movie, but then i watched it and it had nothing to do with the time war and it seemed like the time lords were alive and well.

so then i went and tried to do some reading, but i couldn't seem to get a straight answer there either.

so this is what i understand from what i've read and pieced together.
-the "great time war" referred to in the new series was never really portrayed in the cannon TV series, only mentioned and referenced.
-the new series seems to have somewhat made it up and left it to the audience to simply accept that it happened and we just haven't seen it.
-there are, however, numerous wars and "time wars" that may or may not be what is referred to in the tv series as "the great time war" in various other media and spin-offs like books and audio plays. (each war may be distinct and only some actually are THE "time war")

so can the people who have actually seen the ones before the 2005 series let me know if i've got it right?
if i don't, could anyone set me straight?
and if i'm completely wrong, and there actually is an official "great time war" portrayed in cannon (or anywhere), could you please tell me where it comes in, like which episode/story or book (even knowing which doctor was involved would be helpful). i'd really like to try to see/read/listen to it. (see what happens when we include audio/video media in literature? whee )

forgive me. what's "RTD"?

i know that it's not ENTIRELY made up. i just don't know if it was ever actually shown.

Yes, Doom' has her facts straight. smile

It's never really been explored in the series yet so no one really knows exactly what happened.

If you're talking about the big war in the Virgin Novels that destroys Gallifrey, RTD has said that is NOT the same as the Time War he is talking about. I think that means he is ignoring the book series.

All I can gather is that there was a war between the Daleks and Timelords, Gallifrey+ Timelords were destroyed (except the doctor and a human Master, Daleks and Master hid. Some daleks may remain, but Rose killed most of 'em.

I haven't been paying attention to it - and I should have been - but I think that the Big Finish Audios are doing something related to The Time War because they started a new series of 8th Doctor adventures which I thought was going to have some connection to the new series but I haven't been keeping up with them on BBC 7 so I don't know.

Big Finish Website

On a side note Big Finish have just redesigned their site, thereby confusing and upsetting me all at once since I loved the old design, but they now have a section specially for all the Audios featuring David Tennant. Which I thought was kinda nice of them.

Doomschneider now knows all this since I PM'd her while waiting for my application to clear, but here for the benefit of anyone else interested is some detail...


Basically, there are three Great Time Wars in Gallifrey's history, the second of which never happened. Time Wars are like that.

1) The Eternal Wars (I don't know why they're called that since they didn't go on for eternity and didn't involve the Eternals, but there you go).
In the original series there are lots of references to early wars in Gallifrey's history - against vampires and the suchlike.

During the Seventh Doctor novels then these get linked together and portrayed as the big scrap in which the Time Lords get rid of all the irrational and impossible things that couldn't exist in their version of history.

It was the war, or series of wars, in which they made reality theirs, by eliminating all the stuff that didn't fit with their idea of what should be real.

This all happened about ten million years before the Doctor's time.

2) The War in Heaven.
In the Eighth Doctor novels then, starting with Alien Bodies, he becomes aware of a war approaching in Gallifrey's future. This all becomes quite a saga as everyone starts getting ready for it, choosing sides or finding somewhere to hide. All the time interacting with the consequences of a conflict that hasn't happened yet.

And as it turns out, never will. As in The Ancestor Cell then the Doctor prevents the War ever from having happening by taking the radical step of destroying Gallifrey before it can.

The Faction Paradox novels, audios and comics though continue to be set in the timeline/timelines in which this War went ahead, and it's exhaustively discussed in the faux-encyclopedia The Book of the War.

Put simply, if you come across a reference to the Time War in the BBC novels, it's this one they're talking about.

3)The Last Great Time War
This is the war with the Daleks we heard about for the first time in the new TV series, but caught a little glimpse of beforehand in the novel The Tomorrow Windows.

At the end of the Eighth Doctor novels, in The Gallifrey Chronicles, then the Doctor is given the means to undo his destruction of Gallifrey and restore the planet to history. He does, but the planet then gets destroyed anyway in the War with the Daleks.

RTD has compared this with humanity getting itself into two World Wars in the same half-century.

This all fits very nicely with the Doctor's lines in Dalek - "I watched it happen... I made it happen...I tried to stop it"

smile