|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:15 pm
Well, I've studied magick a lot. I've read lots of books on the subject, and they all scream of "BULLSHIT!" despite being interesting reads.
Now, what I'm asking for here is ANY kind of way to prove to me that magick is real. I've always been a skeptic, but I've always wanted to believe. Tell me of something simple I can do, something that will let me see that magick is real, or give me some sort of other proof. ANYTHING.
If you believe in it so much, and claim to be able to practice it, then you should very well be able to prove it's real.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:22 am
For the most part, I'm in your shoes. I want physical, visible proof of magick's existence. However, it seems to me that in order to experience magic, you have to be open to the idea.
A part of me thinks that alot of what people think they experience is all in their head; they wish to believe something badly enough that they convince their concious mind that there is a sensation there that really isn't. While it's still possible that this can account for some cases, a good friend of mine (the one who introduced me to magick) has made enrgy balls for me to feel, and even gifted me some energy (it felt prickly- almost hurt). So, I suppose it's really something you need to experience yourself, but you won't be able to do it in an instance. There's no quick fix; you'll have to practice for a bit. It really helps to know someone in real life to help you, but besides that, I can't suggest much since I'm still just learning myself.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:27 am
8Bit Jack For the most part, I'm in your shoes. I want physical, visible proof of magick's existence. However, it seems to me that in order to experience magic, you have to be open to the idea. A part of me thinks that alot of what people think they experience is all in their head; they wish to believe something badly enough that they convince their concious mind that there is a sensation there that really isn't. While it's still possible that this can account for some cases, a good friend of mine (the one who introduced me to magick) has made enrgy balls for me to feel, and even gifted me some energy (it felt prickly- almost hurt). So, I suppose it's really something you need to experience yourself, but you won't be able to do it in an instance. There's no quick fix; you'll have to practice for a bit. It really helps to know someone in real life to help you, but besides that, I can't suggest much since I'm still just learning myself. Hmph. What you say matches up with the magick books I've read. They all made me come to the conclusion that they are some kind of stupid illusions. If magick really is what I think it is, then it works, in a sense, but it's nothing magical. It's more of a psyche thing that causes you to get more willpower and such. It doesn't work on me, because I don't believe in it and I see the illusion in it all =/
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:14 pm
I guess the best way to put it is for you to prove it to yourself. You have to want to believe in it in order to even give it a shot. Open your mind a bit, allow for the possibility to exist, and practice it yourself. Again, it really is best to have an experienced teacher; still, I'm sure one can self-teach. You just may not know what it is you're looking for. This page could be a good starting point. Some of the stuff (like the elemental magicks and telekinesis) look hokey, but the energy exercises in the beginning magick section are pretty good. I haven't adapted my senses yet, so I haven't been able to see anything, but I've felt things quite strongly. This afternoon I made my most potent energy ball thus far; I could actually feel it pushing back. My hands felt like two repelling magnets. I guess I'm as willing as I am to believe in auras and energy manipulation simply because they confirm beliefs and theories I've made myself. How some people seem to inadvertently affect those around them, how people can sense others' emotions, that you can control your own aura, etc. To each their own, though. My fiancee refuses to believe anything until I can actually see it. If you still think it's an illusion, that's fine. If you try it, though, even if you don't come away with magickal abilities, you'll at least develop decent mental control and clarity. It's mostly all about meditation and focusing your mind.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:16 am
Thank you very much!
I've done some browsing of the site you provided, and I'm intrigued. I'm sure this will be very useful. I'm going to read all of this carefully, and hope I can get some results.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 4:58 am
Nekoyuusha If you believe in it so much, and claim to be able to practice it, then you should very well be able to prove it's real. Then let me say something like that... If you believe in the existance of reality, and claim that it does exist. then you should very well be able to prove it's real... One can't prove something even if it does exist... but one can prove that something doesn't exist... Instead of believing everything is false until proven true... Think the opposite... Everything is true until proven false. Every theory in the world are taken as true until someone else show that it was wrong at some point and bring up a new theory that nearer to the true.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:43 pm
ChiyuriYami Nekoyuusha If you believe in it so much, and claim to be able to practice it, then you should very well be able to prove it's real. Then let me say something like that... If you believe in the existance of reality, and claim that it does exist. then you should very well be able to prove it's real... One can't prove something even if it does exist... but one can prove that something doesn't exist... Instead of believing everything is false until proven true... Think the opposite... Everything is true until proven false. Every theory in the world are taken as true until someone else show that it was wrong at some point and bring up a new theory that nearer to the true. You won't have eyes tonight. You won't have ears or a tongue; you will wander the underworld blind, deaf and dumb... It's not so much a matter of proving that reality is real, but that showing that if you believe reality isn't real, then you get into all sorts of absurdities. And you're completely wrong about proving things. If psi exists, it can be proven. It can't be disproved, because people can always find explanations for why science can't discover it. On the other hand, no theory is taken as true until there's enough evidence to show it's probably right. It seems your view of reality is the exact opposite of what's real. ...and all the dead will know: this is Hector, fool who thought he killed Achilles.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:04 am
Baron von Turkeypants On the other hand, no theory is taken as true until there's enough evidence to show it's probably right. That not what I said... don't change my words.. Someone bring a theory with the proof that the last one wasn't fully correct.. In the time were people though the earth was flat.. Someone though it was round and looked for the proof that it wasn't flat by going one way to the other around the Earth in medicin, People will follow protocols until someone bring a new one with the proof the previous one isn't as effective as the new one
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:25 am
ChiyuriYami Baron von Turkeypants On the other hand, no theory is taken as true until there's enough evidence to show it's probably right. That not what I said... don't change my words. ChiyuriYami Every theory in the world are taken as true until someone else show that it was wrong at some point and bring up a new theory that nearer to the true. It's exactly what you said, princess. "Every theory is true until proven otherwise" is an incorrect statement; yes, theories do have to be logical and internally consistant, but many magickal theories are such -- that does not mean for a second they're true. Theories aren't considered to be true until they're supported by corroborative evidence. With that out the way: Nekoyuusha If you believe in it so much, and claim to be able to practice it, then you should very well be able to prove it's real. Just because I believe in something does not mean I should be able to prove it. I believe that the square root of ten is an irrational number, but I can't perform the proof for it. However, on a less semantic note -- I disagree. I think magick can only work if you believe in it. Of course, observer-expectancy comes into play, but I personally think that, regardless of expectancy, the fact that I get results when I need them is good enough. No-one's forcing you to believe; if you don't want to accept it, then don't.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 8:36 am
You won't have eyes tonight. You won't have ears or a tongue; you will wander the underworld blind, deaf and dumb... I can prove the square root of ten is irrational  ...and all the dead will know: this is Hector, fool who thought he killed Achilles.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:41 am
ChiyuriYami Nekoyuusha If you believe in it so much, and claim to be able to practice it, then you should very well be able to prove it's real. Then let me say something like that... If you believe in the existance of reality, and claim that it does exist. then you should very well be able to prove it's real... One can't prove something even if it does exist... but one can prove that something doesn't exist... I don't want it to seem like the guild is attacking you, but... It's actually almost impossible to prove something doesn't exist. go here www.mprilc.frih.net > energy manipulation > articles by skill level > then pick the lowest skill level, it has my definition of reality. Nekoyuusha; Read Limitless Mind by Russel Targ. It's an interesting read, written by the man who help pioneer the invention of the laser. cool And magick is like a totally subjective thing... It takes a LOT of practice to actually do something worth while unless you're one of the gifted types who can break tables with sheer willpower alone. Just like reality, magick exists whether you believe it or not, but the perception of it is subjective to your own mind.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 5:02 pm
You can't disprove the existence of anything physical, but you can generally prove it (unless you're a diehard philosophical retard who says 'how can you KNOW the table is REALLY there?"). That's why I prefer mathematics: you can both prove things exist and disprove other things' existence.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:52 pm
There is no proof as of this point. It's similar to religion. It's not something you can write on a piece of paper and show data proving it. You have to experience it yourself and decide yourself. There is proof out there, but a better question is, will it stand up to the sheer will power and closed-mindedness of society? Evidence is useless until it is believed in.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:55 pm
What your talking about seems like schrodinger's cat... Though I don't think I spelled that right...? XD
Or used it in the right context, for that matter... ^-^;;;
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|