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 Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:24 pm
ooo it's so tempting to put all my opinions out there....unfortunately I'm a wimp and most people seem to enjoy shooting me down since they don't agree with me...
So, do you have any hazardous opinions?
Do you think it's a good idea to let everyone know what you think, or to keep quiet until the right moment?
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:46 pm
BOTH!!
AHAHaa!!!
You have to make sure that the moment you wait for will be the most crucial or beneficial for you to in the argument.
Unless you are arguing for the sake the attention (lol).
That is my opinion.
And as for people shooting you down- so what?! Nobody can say that you've lost unless they are you!
I really do mean that. Therea re ways to rework your argument and refute loud, argumentative people.
The main things is, how you present your argument.
If you sound collected and present your opinions calmly and rationally, most people will find it easier to agree with you.
Even if the one who you are talking with does not agree, you may convince the people nearby, those listening. That's worth the effort to hold your tongue at the right moment.
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:47 pm
That being said- this is the anarchy forum, you may as well state your gosh-darned opinion.
NOWW!!!!! scream stare xd
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:40 pm
Somehow, Frog, I never thought you would be the one to hold your tongue that often from the way you act everywhere else. Personally, I think it's something that depends on the situation. Sometimes you just want to boldly smack an enormous wall of arguments up there and dare anyone to try to take them on, and then sometimes you want to try and stick to just rebuttals until their case weakens a touch, then shove in a direct argument in there to really boost your case.
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Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 12:31 pm
I guess it's mostly just discouraging to get shot down so much, lol...
But oh well, it will make me a stronger person right? lol
OOO here's a good topic: abortion is murder!
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Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:17 pm
Personaly i just randomly pick a time to rant out about something and then start arguing with the first person to try to prove me wrong simply for sport.I already told you my ooppinion and after that its just random shouting and explaining my first post incase someone didnt get it.
Oh and why didnt anyone attack her for the punctuation.Or wait is this just the wrong time and the dude who said i have bad punctuation not oinline right now ?
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Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:33 am
Calopterynx I guess it's mostly just discouraging to get shot down so much, lol... But oh well, it will make me a stronger person right? lol OOO here's a good topic: abortion is murder! Rawr, you asking for some bullet through your wings? scream blaugh lol Then I say... Abortion equals quick and easy sollution to all your future problems. Why? Lets see... Abortion... why have abortion? Maybe it was unplanned, the protection didn't work, you're in school, you've grown immune to anti-pregnancy pills, you got raped, you don't have a reliable partner, your partner doesn't want the baby, you don't want the baby, your parents don't want the baby, the surgeon certainly doesn't want the baby, your partner left you, you're unemployed, you got financial problems, you might end up on the street and die along with your baby. Lets say we live in a world without abortion... You're forced to have a baby you don't want, your partner is forced to pay parental support, your life gets miserable because you're having a baby and you can't do anything to prevent it, you go into a major depression, you start drinking, you do drugs, social service takes your child away, you drink more, you lose your job, you lose your house, you end up on the street lonely and die there and you think WHY DO WE LIVE IN A WORLD WITHOUT ABORTION?! Well, that's what could happen for the so called "Average Citizens" and there are those born in a fairytale with rich religious parents who give them everything they point at, who got more than they need to take care of a baby. Then we can start talking about if abortion is ok or not ok. What can we say about this... sometimes, it's far more cruel giving birth to a child and letting it live in a world of pain, suffering and mental discomfort than removing it before it gets a chance to experience it. ninja Like a vicious person once said "With one simple movement I could kill you, but I won't, I shall spare your life and then enjoy the look on your face as I kill everyone you hold dear infront of you while you helplessly watch, then I'll set you free and let you live your so called life." Sometimes, it's more cruel letting someone live rather than finishing off. 3nodding
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Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:34 pm
HAHA, thanks a lot Wako! Anyways, my loudness can be a strength. I used to be a very quiet girl (and diddn't fit in, etc), so when I decided to start speaking my mind, a lot of people who thought I agreed with them game me sh!t. It was hard, I had to learn to argue if I was going to learn to speak. That was the only way I could show people that I respected myself.
Quitarias: Don't be mad at Wnx, he really wants the guild to be good quality, and I don't think he meant to attack your writing style. If you did want to ask him about it, his name is on the main page with the rest of us mod types.
Also- how you said you like to debate? I've done that from time to time to blow off steam. XO Has to be someone who's obnoxious and deserves it, tho. ^^
And about abortion- woah. I don't ever agree with killing to prevent an unhappy life. Especially since some of the best inventors and world-changers started out in very bad places, and grew up determined to change their situation. Having a bad childhood (or babyhood etc) does not mean that you are fated to have a bad life. If everyone started out rich, the whole world would grow poor together, but not appreciating what they have.
If the whole world were poor, they'd work together and all of society would benefit.
The pilgrims and early settlers in America are a good example- every day was life or death here when they first came, but that only increased their need to live well.
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Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 2:12 pm
I remembered a different abortion debate thread about whether the man should have a word or not when it comes to abortion xd
I found it rather silly, one thing I can say is that unwanted kids = miserable life.
Example 1
Woman accidently gets pregnant, man doesn't want the baby for some reason, lets say financial reasons, woman wants to have the baby. *gasp*
Man really doesn't want baby and wants to separate WHAM! He gets a parental support order from court and is stuck paying them for years.
So much for equality... 3nodding maybe it's stupid to b***h about mens' higher salary when things like this are still floating around? You decide.
Example 2
Woman accidently gets pregnant, man WANTS the baby O_o and she wants to have an abortion, now this atleast seems obvious to me that if she doesn't want the baby it's up to her to decide if she wants it or not, since the man can't force her going through pregnancy when she doesn't want to as it would be rather or very cruel.
So in my opinion, the best solution:
Woman wants + Man doesn't want = Don't have
Man wants + Woman doesn't want = Don't have
Both want = Have
I suppose there are ways when woman insists on having baby while man really, really, really doesn't want... involving lots of psycho actions and "accidents".
and to get rid of someone who forces a woman through abortion there are probably several ways...
I got sudden urge to direct a horror movie... 3nodding
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:41 am
I think if they didn't want a kid they should have thought about that before they had sex... NOT AFTER... because after the child has been conceived, its too late. Why kill the innocent child for what his or her parents did? How is that fair?
People use abortion as an excuse to have sex without the consequences. I feel that that is both irresponsible and extremely selfish. It promotes a society where there is an "easy fix" for everything, instead of teaching people to take responsibility for what they have done.
As far as the unwanted kids=miserable life...lets think about other people who are unwanted. Have you ever hated a teacher (because they gave you a bad grade or failed you, for example)? So, that teacher is unwanted. Would it be right to kill that teacher because he or she is unwanted?
Or an annoying neighbor...?
Or that guy who cut you off on the freeway...?
Or your mother-in-law...?
The point is, they are human just like you and me and every other person and they have a right to life just like you.
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:49 pm
Significant difference between unwanted neighbours and unwanted babies...
The neighbours you can just move away from if they cause you alot of trouble. A baby... well, you got responsability for that... you can't just move away from that... or wait... you could leave it on the street and run away from that aswell, though then that would be far more cruel than having an abortion in my opinion, but it is one of the cheaper alternatives.
Well, I suppose there are those who have sex for the pleasure and those who have sex solely for reproductional purposes. Abortions aren't made for free though which could be lesson enough to take responsibility... unless you got rich parents who take care of it for you, then we can discuss whether it's fair to teach people a lesson by forcing them to give birth.
So what if they're human, we got plenty of humans in this world, infact, we got too many.
So, humans got the right to live, just because you're born human automaticly gives you all sorts of rights, though insects are killed for being annoying and fish are caught to be put on our dinner plates.
"Having rights" is a tricky term, what exactly gives someone the right to live? Everyone has the right to live... even those who worship a different religion *cough* and ofcourse... native inhabitants such as... Indians *cough*
Ok, lets compare abortion to America.
Why did such alot of natives have to get killed? Survival or pleasure to kill?
I suppose you'd say survival, so, lets compare that to abortion, why abort? To survive, I don't think many actually "Enjoy" having an abortion and I find it mean to criticise their actions if they do choose abortion.
If someone impregnates you against your will at the age of lets say... 15, what would you do, quit school to stay at home throwing up in a bathroom while giving up most of your hopes and dreams as you're chained to this baby, you simply won't have much time and "life" has hardly begun.
I wonder if it would be fair if you had to "throw away" your own life to give an unwanted baby the opportunity to live. I certainly wouldn't.
Maybe we should debate if male masturbation is mass murder. 3nodding
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:40 pm
If you believe there are too many people on this planet, then, by all means, you are welcome to be the first to leave (Mars is lovely this time of year, I hear...) But that's ridiculous, isn't it? Basically, you can't expect it to be right or just to do something to a baby that you would never do to yourself or any other human (e.g. kill them).
Yes, I honestly believe every person does have a right to live. No matter their religion, or race. I'm not quite sure how Native Americans killing each other has anything to do with abortion... I don't remember mentioning it, before, but if you'd like to clarify, by all means be my guest. I don't think abortion is critical for survival, in fact, it's the opposite since it's ending a life.
Yes, it would be extremely cruel to leave a baby on the streets. But that is not the only option for people who do not have the means to support a child. I have friends who are adopted and I find it insulting to think that their are people who think this place would have been better if their parents had aborted them.
As far as giving birth, people have been doing that for centuries. Even a 15 year old can handle it (I know some who have.) Everyone has obstacles to overcome in their lives, but no one's obstacle should be solved through murder.
I hope that helping a child is NEVER a waste of time, not mine nor anyone else's.
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 11:02 am
Hehe, how cliché
Humans killing themselves is good in many ways, some people might think war is bad but it's actually very good for the world, you keep the number of people down, you give plenty of opportunities to unemployed to get jobs and with less people you get more space to live. War makes economy bloom.
Point about the Native Americans is that plenty of them got killed because white people showed up with guns and wanted the land during the collonisation rush, maybe the native americans didn't have the right to own the land they had lived on for so long, nor the right to live on it. Though what would America be today if those countless of lives weren't sacrificed. The strongest survives, in this case, the natives threw hatchets at gunners.
There is "living" and there is "being alive" though sounding similar, they have completely different meanings, by giving a baby the state of "being alive" you might have to stop "living".
I'll always see people that have children early in life to be wasting their own lives and potential. I would probably not have kids until I'm past the age of 35 or so, which is when I've experienced most parts of the world, gained the expertise I need and am able to support my family as a reliable person, not an inexperienced youngster without an education.
I suppose I'm just the kind of person who got the highest potential to make a career.
I'd say it's rather hard not to waste time on kids, though the term "timewaste" differs from person to person. In my personal point of view, there are many better things you could do to better your financial situation, instead of babysitting a toddler.
More personal debate opinions: I'm also pro Death Penalty and Homosexuals adopting. blaugh
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 12:11 pm
The main big difference in this is that abortion is a contravertial topic with two sides to the same coin.
Abortion is killing a child.
Killing anyone is wrong.
Keeping a child isnt always what everyone wants.
Keeping the child isnt always in anyones best interests.
There are many issuses about this but personally i would allow abortion to continue. Abortion isnt always wrong, so then it shouldnt be totally outlawed. Abortion shouldnt be freely availible though, that would be wrong.
Dissagree? Say so then.
Also, Quitarias: I said what i said only because punctuation makes things much easier and better to read. When i read your scentences its hard to distinguish between what is what. Organised lines of argument or sencences make things easier, thats all. Sorry if ive caused any offence. And if i have im sorry.
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 1:26 pm
Yes, abortion has a lot of other topics involved, but lets keep it as focused as possible for now.
Now, instead of an opinion, i just have a question for WnX Hokaru: When do you believe abortion is okay? (don't worry, you'll get my opinions soon enough lol)
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