|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:00 pm
In religion class we are going over the 8th commandment and my teacher says that you can't lie under any circumstance, She did teach us about Metal Reservation, but that's not always possible and under horrible situations it's extremely hard to think of the exact right wording to use so that the other person deceives themselves and yet your words are still truthful. She also taught us about Double Effect, but she says it doesn't apply since the act of lying is intrinsically evil.
My dad says that you can lie to someone if they have no right to know. He showed me a passage from the Bible where some Pharisees asked Jesus if He was going to a wedding feast, they were planning to kill Him, and He answered no, and then He did go. My teacher said He changed his mind, but my dad thinks that they didn't have a right to know. (I forget the verse; I'll post it here later today, after I find it.)
The problem with mental reservation is it is possible someone will want a "yes" or a "no" answer, and you can't really make them deceive themselves in that circumstance.
For instance, if a Nazi went to someone and said "Are you hiding Jews, yes or no?" If they were hiding 100 Jews, would they have to say yes?
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:01 pm
of course not. i believe if its for a noble cause you can but it is best to decieve those who would want to do them harm. don't forget some of us are blessed with certain gifts, like i am blessed with the gifts of words, i pick up on languages easily and words come to me naturally. also my patron saint is St. Francis De Sales. you can always quickly pray to him for word guidance. truely if you are desperate then the words should come to you. itd prolly be best to go to confession afterwards anyways.
like today so stupid preppy chick ask me who i was dating, and i know she was gonna start rumors and try and break me and her up so i lied to her about it. but im still gonna mention i lied in confession. everything is forgivable.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:33 am
a lie is a sin no matter what, but there are still degrees to the sin based on what kind of lie it is,
a small lie that doesn't hurt anyone for example, is only a venial sin, but a lie that ruins someones reputation (like gossiping) is a mortal sin.
you don't have to lie to someone to keep something from them, all you need to do is tell them that's it's best that you don't say anything, or you'd rather not say, or however else you want to say it,
but as for things like, someones having a surprise party and you need to lie to them to keep it a secret and not let them catch on, i think that would be fine, because it's all in good fun, and it's not hurtful in any way.
as for the Nazi thing...i'm not sure...but i think that would still be a sin..but not a mortal sin, you wouldn't go to hell for it,
but i think a situation like that could be altogether avoided through lots of prayer and trust in God.
and perhaps even if someone told the truth that they were hiding jews, maybe God would save them anyways, because of their great love and obedience to Him.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 6:41 pm
I think that very few things exist in absolutes. Generally speaking, yes, lying is bad and sinful. However, in some instances, it can be necessary for your safety and/or the safety of others. And I think in that case, no, lying is not sinful if it is done for a good cause and if one is left with little other choice.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:36 am
As stated previously, a lie is always a sin, but like you also mentioned there are ways to tell the truth without giving the answer that the asker would really like. When you said Jesus "lied" to the Pharasies about going to the wedding, that would imply that Jesus sinned. This is not so because Jesus never sinned, seeing as he was/is God and was born without sin.
To clear that up, at an earlier point in his life he must have had no intention on going to that wedding, probably because he didn't know about it.
Also, lying to save lives is a modifier, which is a fairly uncommon thing but the only way to bend around Natural Law none-the-less. If one were to tell the truth and know that in doing so they would cause even one death, the would be mortally sinning. If they lied to save anybody, their sin would be modified to a "life saving" deed and thus becomes good. Evil does not deserve to continue so anything to hamper its progress is greatly appreciated.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:01 pm
i actually did some more research on this, and i was mistaken in my last reply with the last thing i said,
i recently had to help someone else with this same problem, and this is what i read from another book that explained it very well...
"It is never lawful to tell a lie, no matter what the object. However, mental reservations and equivocations are not sinful, so long as they are not unlawfully deceptive. Here we must distinguish between strict and broad mental reservations:
Strict mental reservations are always a lie and therefore sinful.
The reason is that there is no clue given in the person's answer as to the true meaning the speaker is intending, because the mental reservation is kept strictly in the speaker's mind, and there is no outward indication as to the limited meaning. For example: You ask a person "Did you leave town yesterday," and he answers "No," meaning, "I did not leave town yesterday in a car."
Broad mental reservations are not sinful so long as the broad mental reservation is used only as a refuge to guard a secret from prying questioners who have no right to the information they seek,
(Austin Fagothey, S.J., Right and Reason, Page 319). In a Broad mental reservation, there is a clue to the correct meaning of the answer, e.g., when a child under instruction from his mother tells a salesman, "My mother is not at home." The meaning is, "Not at home to you." The salesman did not have a right to know. Our Lord Himself used the broad mental reservation for a serious reason. (Cf. John 7:8-10)."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
