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 Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 6:28 am
Yup not quite sure which subforum this should be in but... I just saw the 4th movie, loved the way they made the special effects and everything. Ya they did change from the books view, but I still liked it. Anyways.
The whole time whenever Snape was around I looked at him differently. I'm one of those people who think that Snape is a Death Eater, and follows Voldermort and never Dumbledore. I so felt like screaming THE DUDE'S GONNA KILL YOU!
Ya, then I reread parts of the other books, whenever Snape came in I was like holyshit how much did they trust this dude...
Discuss looking at Snape differently.
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Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:23 am
Ah yes... even re-reading the books I feel like jumping in an smacking Snape around... BUT do we know that Snape is really evil? Are we underestimating Dumbledore's intelligence... hmmm....
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Toothsome Conversationalist
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Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:27 am
I'm reserving judgement on where Snape's loyalties lie. I really have no clue and would rather not try to guess. Either way, I'll be happy with Rowling's explanation when Book 7 comes out, and have no disappointment at all. That being said, I still read and see Snape the same way as before. I take him at face value.
By the way, you don't have to mark for spoilers here. Everybody here has read all six books and even if they hadn't they all agreed to the entry requirement of understanding that most won't be marking spoilers here.
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Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:40 am
I trust Snape, and I've always done. I really don't think he's "evil," because... Well, quite frankly, it'd be way too obvious. Also, Dumbledore trusts him. He didn't trust Tom Marvolo Riddle (aka Voldemort, obviously) when he was in school, even though everyone liked and trusted him. So... I think that's a major point.
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Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:00 am
Liadan_Black Ah yes... even re-reading the books I feel like jumping in an smacking Snape around... BUT do we know that Snape is really evil? Are we underestimating Dumbledore's intelligence... hmmm.... We don't know at all that he's really evil or not. I mean you think that Dumbledore wouldn't make a huge mistake, but then again he's made a mistake of not telling Harry about the prophecy leading to Sirius' death...
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Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:18 pm
ilovemm I trust Snape, and I've always done. I really don't think he's "evil," because... Well, quite frankly, it'd be way too obvious. Also, Dumbledore trusts him. He didn't trust Tom Marvolo Riddle (aka Voldemort, obviously) when he was in school, even though everyone liked and trusted him. So... I think that's a major point.
If the whole Snape-killed-Dumbledore thing was all planned out, it would be a huge mistake for Dumbledore not to tell anyone. Because no one was prepaired for it at all. Dumbledore was like, head of everything and had a major influence on the Ministry that no one else had, and people kist weren't prepaired for him to bite it. Also, no one's going to trust Snape anymore so even though he did 'keep his cover' it's not worth anything when no one will listen to him. I strongly believe that if Dumbledore had planned this whole thing out he would have been smart enough to tell at least someone before going and getting him self killed on purpose.
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Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:13 am
Hmm. I really agree with Frederick. Even though when I read the book, I thought the whole thing seemed way too planned, and I thought Snape was doing it on Dumbledore's orders, I still feel it would be a mistake on Dumbledore's part to not tell anyone. But I never liked Dumbledore anyway, and he makes several big mistakes per book, so I'm not banking on his omnipotence or anything.
At this point, whichever way the plot goes, some people will be saying "told you so" and others will be in denial. Personally, I can't decide which I would like better, so I guess I'll have to wait and see.
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Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:27 am
CaptainJames Hmm. I really agree with Frederick. Even though when I read the book, I thought the whole thing seemed way too planned, and I thought Snape was doing it on Dumbledore's orders, I still feel it would be a mistake on Dumbledore's part to not tell anyone. But I never liked Dumbledore anyway, and he makes several big mistakes per book, so I'm not banking on his omnipotence or anything. At this point, whichever way the plot goes, some people will be saying "told you so" and others will be in denial. Personally, I can't decide which I would like better, so I guess I'll have to wait and see.
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Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 7:05 pm
Quote: People keep saying that it woudl be 'way too obvious' when the majority of the people think that Snape is good. I think it would be more of a shock to the majority of the HP fans if Snape actually is evil. Also, Dumbledore's human. He makes mistakes too, y'know.
What I meant was that it would be way too obvious because JKR tried to make him look evil in nearly every book. If she really did make him turn out to be evil in the end, it would be so much of a let-down for me. If she was pushing so hard for people to think he's evil, why would she make him be evil in the end? It just doesn't seem like a JKR thing to do. Quote: If the whole Snape-killed-Dumbledore thing was all planned out, it would be a huge mistake for Dumbledore not to tell anyone.
I don't think the Snape killing Dumbledore thing was planned. I think that, when Snape went to talk to Bellatrix and Narcissa in the beginning of HBP, he bluffed knowing what they were talking about, and agreed to finish it for Draco without knowing what "it" was. I think he's just very good at being a spy. I also think that after he completed the Unbreakable Vow he found out what "it" was, and then had to tell Dumbledore. I think that whole situation went something like that.
Also, as a side note, I think the look of pure hatred Harry saw on Snape's face after he had killed Dumbledore wasn't a look of pure loathing, but one of pure anguish. If Snape really did have no choice other than to kill Dumbledore because of the Unbreakable Vow, think how he'd feel? Incredibly shitty, that's for sure.
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:17 am
ilovemm Quote: People keep saying that it woudl be 'way too obvious' when the majority of the people think that Snape is good. I think it would be more of a shock to the majority of the HP fans if Snape actually is evil. Also, Dumbledore's human. He makes mistakes too, y'know.
What I meant was that it would be way too obvious because JKR tried to make him look evil in nearly every book. If she really did make him turn out to be evil in the end, it would be so much of a let-down for me. If she was pushing so hard for people to think he's evil, why would she make him be evil in the end? It just doesn't seem like a JKR thing to do. ilovemm Quote: If the whole Snape-killed-Dumbledore thing was all planned out, it would be a huge mistake for Dumbledore not to tell anyone.
I don't think the Snape killing Dumbledore thing was planned. I think that, when Snape went to talk to Bellatrix and Narcissa in the beginning of HBP, he bluffed knowing what they were talking about, and agreed to finish it for Draco without knowing what "it" was. I think he's just very good at being a spy. I also think that after he completed the Unbreakable Vow he found out what "it" was, and then had to tell Dumbledore. I think that whole situation went something like that. ilovemm Also, as a side note, I think the look of pure hatred Harry saw on Snape's face after he had killed Dumbledore wasn't a look of pure loathing, but one of pure anguish. If Snape really did have no choice other than to kill Dumbledore because of the Unbreakable Vow, think how he'd feel? Incredibly shitty, that's for sure.
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 8:17 am
[Fredrick] ilovemm I trust Snape, and I've always done. I really don't think he's "evil," because... Well, quite frankly, it'd be way too obvious. Also, Dumbledore trusts him. He didn't trust Tom Marvolo Riddle (aka Voldemort, obviously) when he was in school, even though everyone liked and trusted him. So... I think that's a major point. I agree with both of the claims I've quoted, but with the coda that Snape is human as well. On IMDB, I've been shunted by both sides of this debate to the "Snape is good" club, because I trust him, and believe unflichingly, unfailingly, and unquestioningly that he is either redeemed or redeemable, and must be so for the series and the brilliant literary creation of his character to hang together. Redemption hangs on sin, though, and good guys can never earn it, simply because they don't need it. Snape does, and he will have his. I say that "Snape is ambiguous." That's all I'll commit to.
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 2:32 pm
i_heart_ron [Fredrick] ilovemm I trust Snape, and I've always done. I really don't think he's "evil," because... Well, quite frankly, it'd be way too obvious. Also, Dumbledore trusts him. He didn't trust Tom Marvolo Riddle (aka Voldemort, obviously) when he was in school, even though everyone liked and trusted him. So... I think that's a major point. I agree with both of the claims I've quoted, but with the coda that Snape is human as well. On IMDB, I've been shunted by both sides of this debate to the "Snape is good" club, because I trust him, and believe unflichingly, unfailingly, and unquestioningly that he is either redeemed or redeemable, and must be so for the series and the brilliant literary creation of his character to hang together. Redemption hangs on sin, though, and good guys can never earn it, simply because they don't need it. Snape does, and he will have his. I say that "Snape is ambiguous." That's all I'll commit to. Well, I'm glad you think that. But that doesn't exactly prove anything. >.>
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 8:54 pm
Why prove anything? It'll be an unbelieveably boring 2-3 years if we've got everything proven in the first 6 months. I did think Snape was evil the whole time for a good 2 hours during which I was like, "OMG I have to reread the whole series now! the whole world has changed! everything's shifted! it's all collapsing on me!" Then my roommate finished the book and scoffed, "of COURSE he's not evil!" and it all got better. It made sense again. Because really, do we want Harry Potter to end like this?
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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:02 pm
Of course, the books are told third person from Harry's point of view and really, how many things has Harry been right about? I put more trust into Hermione's views that Harry's.
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Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:04 pm
That may have been my biggest problem with HBP...I did not like Harry being "right."
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