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 Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:30 pm
I wanted to see what peoples opinions were of this article. Personally, I'm a bit disgusted by it. That atheists would make such an outcry over a street sign dedicated for the fallen heroes of 9/11 just because the word heaven was mentioned. This is just another case of a very small minority trying to ruin something special that no one else has any problems with.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:20 pm
I'm not one for religion, I have no particular stance, but I can understand, to some degree, why they would make a deal out of including "Heaven" into a street sign in remembrance of the seven who died within 9/11.
As stated, they're merely saying that not all of those who died were Christian or, possibly, didn't believe in Heaven (or Hell for that matter). But also by putting the statement of "Heaven" in a suggestive religious way, it is prone to offend those who don't believe or define such a statement into one religious category.
The problem is by doing what they did, they may have had approval by the community, but there's also the issue of the inhabitants of the city, state, and even nation. People do visit other places on a daily basis that they could easily be offended by the sign. People are entitled to their own opinion, don't get me wrong, but in some ways, even by having this sign, it could also be seen as "forcing" an idea/concept onto others.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:38 pm
People pretty much are offended by almost everything nowadays, it's a complete mystery why people still care. Goddamn extreme left rolleyes . I haz a message for these easily offended people: "Don't sweat the petty stuff, pet the sweaty stuff" xd . But seriously I think the connotation may indeed have been a little too gonk .
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:48 pm
I love how they say that heaven is a Christan only ideal.
I find those people very arrogant. Especially when they said "It implies that heaven actually exists," So he's right and everybody is wrong? Chances are, the families of the firefighters were most likely Christian considering how many Christians there are in America. Like it said, if they wanted to speak against it, they should have gone to the meeting and spoke against it.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:58 pm
Meh. Another outspoken minority of an already 'minor' group ruining it for everyone else. Moderate atheists know that the nation, realistically, is mostly theistic in some form. They know that sort of gesture isn't intended to offend. There are times to be up in arms about 'pressing religion' upon others in that way, but honoring the dead is not one of those times. It's as bad as the WBC protesting at military funerals.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:42 am
I once got told by my Sergeant Major that I should be a little more politically correct because I'm offending people. My response?
"Sergeant major, with all due respect, I've been a PFC two times in my career. i'm not afraid to become one again."
What'd I say?
"May God have mercy on their souls."
I'd make the sign BIGGER! There IS this little thing called the First Amendment, which I'd display directly underneath said sign in big bold words.
Douchecanoes.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:46 am
Mystic Requiem
I love how they say that heaven is a Christan only ideal.
I find those people very arrogant. Especially when they said "It implies that heaven actually exists," So he's right and everybody is wrong? Chances are, the families of the firefighters were most likely Christian considering how many Christians there are in America. Like it said, if they wanted to speak against it, they should have gone to the meeting and spoke against it.
I agree with you. I find those people very arrogant as well. I know what you mean. He sounded like he was trying to sound better than everyone else by saying that. I would laugh so hard if when he dies he finds out there's a heaven and God tells him what does he have to say now as he pushes the down arrow for hell. And that's true, most of the families of the firefighters were probably Christian.I'm shocked that if they knew about the sign, they didn't go to the meeting and said something in the first place.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:50 am
Le Scratch Meh. Another outspoken minority of an already 'minor' group ruining it for everyone else. Moderate atheists know that the nation, realistically, is mostly theistic in some form. They know that sort of gesture isn't intended to offend. There are times to be up in arms about 'pressing religion' upon others in that way, but honoring the dead is not one of those times. It's as bad as the WBC protesting at military funerals.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:53 am
Lord Redtail Rathan I once got told by my Sergeant Major that I should be a little more politically correct because I'm offending people. My response? "Sergeant major, with all due respect, I've been a PFC two times in my career. i'm not afraid to become one again." What'd I say? "May God have mercy on their souls." I'd make the sign BIGGER! There IS this little thing called the First Amendment, which I'd display directly underneath said sign in big bold words. Douchecanoes.
I'd say make the sign bigger too! And definitely put the First Amendment right under it so that they cannot say anything. It will drive them crazy! xD
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:53 am
I have to disagree with the majority. To me, this is a sign that America is not separated by church and state, just like this:
http://ncronline.org/blogs/just-catholic/one-nation-under-god
Plus, in our Constitution we have a clause that has to do with this type of thing:
"The First Amendment's Establishment Clause prohibits the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” This clause not only forbids the government from establishing an official religion, but also prohibits government actions that unduly favor one religion over another. It also prohibits the government from unduly preferring religion over non-religion, or non-religion over religion."
If I am not mistaken, but street signs are public and government owned. That's my view point, and I am just putting out that side of it. It doesn't matter that its for the dead or whatever, the law is law.
(I'm not trying to create a debate nor will I respond if it is leading to one.)
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:30 pm
There is that point as well ... but the public approved of it, as the article states. If these folks had an issue with it they should have spoken out against it during approval, not waited until it went up. If they want to create a lawsuit that will further push moderate atheists and theists alike away from one another, so be it, but, in a nation that is mostly Christian, it's reasonable to expect things like this. It's not a law stating that atheists are unwelcome, nor is it a law stating that people of other religions are unwelcome. It's a street sign and nothing more - might as well rename Los Angeles while we're at it, since the city's name favors religion over non-religion.
Due to the public approval, it's gone through due process. It didn't go up overnight with no public knowledge.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:33 pm
it's just another idiotic display of humanity's most pathetic fear(achitiphobia, the fear of being wrong) .Why can't these people just grow the ******** up? rolleyes
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:14 pm
Shilberu Erikku it's just another idiotic display of humanity's most pathetic fear(achitiphobia, the fear of being wrong) .Why can't these people just grow the ******** up? rolleyes Agreed. The word "heaven" is not nessasarily religious. In the modern era, the word is used in many different contexts. Honoring the fallen does not have to be religious. Heaven is a place of peace no matter what religion. Believing in god or not. People need to grow up. As I've noticed, many Atheist find any reason to bash Christians or any religion. They need to grow up. I believe its nice to have a sign honoring the fallen as such.
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