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 Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 7:23 pm
Question is this: A man raps a woman and she has a child from that rape, if he becomes saved, should he be allowed in the child and mother's life?
I say that if the man becomes saved, he would apologize and stay away from them to let them have peace. The person who brought this up said that is not a christian point of view because we should forgive. Do not wish to offend anyone but the comment the senator made brought this up.
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Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:43 am
God is my strength... "Psalms 28:7"
If God is willing to forgive us, then we should be willing to forgive others.
If the woman is a christian then she needs to forgive Him no matter if he is saved or not. I'm not sure if this is true in all states, but it doesn't matter how the child was conceived, he has legal rights to the child once it's proven that he is in fact the father.
...God is my joy "Psalms 96:11-13"
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Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:11 pm
There was report of a woman who was raped and had a child to the man who raped her. He used that child to stay in her life and terrorize her. She tried many times through the legal system to get something done about this. Finally she ended killing him one night he came over. She told the police it was the only way she was ever going to be safe and free from him. It has happened to more women then just her.
Forgiveness is one thing but forgetting is another. To ask a person to forget the horror they went through is another matter all together. Our military forces come home from servicing during a war with PTSD. They need help and therapy to adjust back to life in the states again. Sometimes years later they can still flash back to what they went through and they never want to speak about their time or experiences while they were serving. How can we ask more from a woman who was raped then we do of our soldiers? Why do we expect her to move on more quickly and easily than a soldier? The event for her was traumatic and horrible. She has no real time for adjustment because she is carrying a child and then as soon as the baby is born she has to allow visitation to the man who raped her. I found a report where the women had to bring the child to the prison so the father could have time with his child.
How many people have wronged you and you have completely forgiven and became friends or even closer than friends with?
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Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:09 pm
God is my strength... "Psalms 28:7"
I'm not saying that forgiveness is the same as forgetting. It's a terrible thing that the law did not do a better job of protecting the woman from her attacker, but that doesn't constitute murder in any way.
I'm not saying the woman would need to just suck it up and get over it. I would never expect her to do that, but if the father chooses to be a part of the child's life then there are things that she will need to do. She will need extensive counseling if she wasn't already in it, she will need Jesus most of all though. She will also need to keep as safe a distance as possible. Especially if the man is not repentant of what he did. If that's the case then the mother needs to do everything she can to protect herself and the child (within the limits of the legal system).
PTSD is a horrible thing to live with no matter who you are. My soon to be ex husband struggles with it and it is very possible that it is linked to many if not all of his major physical health issues. BUT there is a way to heal and move on from it. The more a person speaks about it the easier it becomes to deal with. Jesus can heal even the deepest most awful things that have hurt us in life. I'm not saying that it is an overnight experience. It can take years, and it's painful, but it's very possible. No hurt is too deep for Jesus to heal. No sin against us is too awful for Jesus to forgive or for us to forgive.
I have dealt with my own PTSD and depression over my issues of molestation and abuse for most of my life. I have forgiven all the people from my past. My own sister tried to drown me when we were children, she hated me and did and said some pretty messed up things. She is now my closest friend. She has made amends for her actions, though that came years after I forgave her. that's just one of the many transformations God has made in my life with people.
I am also fully aware that reconciliation doesn't always happen, not everyone will be repentant or even feel a tiny ping of remorse for the things they have done and if they do, most people, without Jesus, will never reach out to make amends. Being active in reading the word and being in prayer for God's wisdom and direction in each relationship and every experience in life is of the utmost importance. We must forgive people and love them regardless of what they do to us, but that doesn't mean we become a door mat. God will show us just where we need to place our boundaries with people and He will give us what we need to hold to them.
...God is my joy "Psalms 96:11-13"
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Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2012 2:14 pm
Hi y'all! Happy Sunday to ya. On the matters of confession, try reading some scriptures like Matthew 10:32 and Luke 12:18, on the subject. As for forgiveness... re read John 3:16 'For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son.....' (Now that is true forgiveness y'all.) Not gonna mix politics with religion and ya shouldn't, but all of this is really a rabbits trail that should be decided between the woman and the legal system, and judge the best by God the only one who is truly worthy to judge anyone about any transgressions. Sorry to hear about this 'woman' who was subjected to so much crud by the man who did that to her, really I am, but all of this is really academic when ya think about whats really real and needed to be done in a Christians own daily walk in this life for our God's glory. Christian huggles y'all!, ~Lyn~
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Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2012 5:05 pm
I agree with the need for counseling. I have had some short talks with my Pastor recently about my past as well. I have decided to cut my parents out of my life for my own sanity. They are extremely controlling and do not approve of the church I attend and my friends at the church. They want my marriage to end as well. I go to a Baptist church and they see that as a betrayal of my faith. I was raised Pentecostal. My brother is 40 and they have him so messed up that he is still living at home and single because every time he gets a girl friend he ends up driving her away. It goes way deeper than all that but there is no need to get into it all.
Needless to say I didn't understand the amount of stress they put on my life until I got to the point I couldn't sleep. I had horrible nightmares every night. I was fighting with my husband and wanted to quit church. When I was a child I would sit up every night with my door locked and the light on, to scared to sleep because of the nightmares. I was turning back into that child again slowly but surely. Almost like a slow but steady breakdown. When my husband and I sat down with the Pastor he agreed that my parents couldn't be allowed to continue that way they are acting. If they call or come over and start with me again they will leave or I will hang up on them. They are so bad they count the number of rings it takes me to answer the phone and I have to explain how long it takes. I was sabotaging friendships and trying to distance myself from God. Now I feel so much more relaxed and last night was the first time in a long time I slept peacefully.
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Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:10 pm
iamlost4ever I agree with the need for counseling. I have had some short talks with my Pastor recently about my past as well. I have decided to cut my parents out of my life for my own sanity. They are extremely controlling and do not approve of the church I attend and my friends at the church. They want my marriage to end as well. I go to a Baptist church and they see that as a betrayal of my faith. I was raised Pentecostal. My brother is 40 and they have him so messed up that he is still living at home and single because every time he gets a girl friend he ends up driving her away. It goes way deeper than all that but there is no need to get into it all. Needless to say I didn't understand the amount of stress they put on my life until I got to the point I couldn't sleep. I had horrible nightmares every night. I was fighting with my husband and wanted to quit church. When I was a child I would sit up every night with my door locked and the light on, to scared to sleep because of the nightmares. I was turning back into that child again slowly but surely. Almost like a slow but steady breakdown. When my husband and I sat down with the Pastor he agreed that my parents couldn't be allowed to continue that way they are acting. If they call or come over and start with me again they will leave or I will hang up on them. They are so bad they count the number of rings it takes me to answer the phone and I have to explain how long it takes. I was sabotaging friendships and trying to distance myself from God. Now I feel so much more relaxed and last night was the first time in a long time I slept peacefully. God is my strength... "Psalms 28:7"
I am glad you are taking the steps to become healthier emotionally and mentally and I'm sure physically by cutting out the people who drag you down. I believe we all need to stay away from people who we know are triggers for us to go back into those dark places and times in our lives. And a lot of times those people are family and it's hard. I know of a family who were disowned by some and had to cut out the rest of their family because of their choices to continue to grow stronger in their faith and talk about those dark family secrets. They have flourished into wonderful light spirited people.
I will pray for you and your situation and for your family as a whole.
...God is my joy "Psalms 96:11-13"
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Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:59 am
Quote: 55:6 Seek ye YHWH while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: 55:7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto YHWH, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our Elohim, for he will abundantly pardon. ~RNKJV, Book of Isaiah Quote: 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee; 5:24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift. ~RNKJV, Book of Matthew This person may or may not ever change. 'Saved' or not. If they've truly accepted Yeshua, they'll have done everything they can to make things right with her. Not continue to mistreat her, or the child. I've had this happen to me. For many years I had a real problem with forgiving him. I knew that the Master wanted this, for me to let everything go. The hatred, the fear, the animosity towards others even that condoned this behavior or treated me as 'unclean' because he had defiled me. But it seemed that every time I turned around, he was doing some new and improved thing to remind me that he was still trying to 'make me see reason' and go back to him (for more of the same). Well, my child is grown now, and sees her father for what he is. She still loves him, as her father. But she has no respect for him, and will no longer waste her time trying to help him be a better person. She's a good kid, and a fine adult. Helping others, and making sure that these things don't happen. Or are taken care of in the eyes of Yah. She's honorable and compassionate, in spite of knowing the circumstances of her conception. But for a very long time, all she could see was my unexplained hatred towards the man that sired her. Until the day that I fully gave all of that to the Father, it left her very confused as to how to handle the situation. We must forgive. We must allow them to see Yeshua Messiah through us. But... we must be smart. Quote: 10:5 These twelve Yahushua sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 10:7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand. ~RNKJV, Book of Matthew Considering the word 'gentiles' at that time may also included those who were not of Yah and did not follow Messiah (Christianity came later), let's assume that we're not talking about the present day gentiles/Christians that are devoted wholly to Jesus our Savior. That gentiles then were those that followed 'man's doctrines' instead of Yah's. So... Let's just not accept what the world tells us if the Father said it wasn't a good thing... Quote: Go not into the way of the Gentiles... Don't follow the crowd. Take the first step. Be free in Yeshua Messiah. And if they aren't (those that oppress and offend), all we can do is plant the seed. Seriously. let Yah take the rest. (And yes, I can still handle a baseball bat) Quote: 10:11 And into whatsoever city or town ye shall enter, inquire who in it is worthy; and there abide till ye go thence. 10:12 And when ye come into an house, salute it. 10:13 And if the house be worthy, let your peace come upon it: but if it be not worthy, let your peace return to you. 10:14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet. ~RNKJV, Book of Matthew But we must live by example. If these people that insist on hurting us aren't of Yah, we live by example and show them. And if they don't have ears to hear, move on. Hard as it is. Don't let them try to make us like them, and destroy our relationship with Yahweh. Never let ha satan pull your chain. lol Yah rocks. When it gets that bad, praise HaShem. And party. smile Got all of your armor? (Ephesians 6:10-20) Prayers for all concerned. Your sister in Yeshuah Messiah, Shalom. ~MW
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Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 3:24 am
Maybe this is a little more in context for these specifics, even though they may not have been married... Quote: 2:14 Yet ye say, Wherefore? Because YHWH hath been witness between thee and the wife of thy youth, against whom thou hast dealt treacherously: yet is she thy companion, and the wife of thy covenant. 2:15 And did not he make one? Yet had he the residue of the spirit. And wherefore one? That he might seek a seed of Elohim. Therefore take heed to your spirit, and let none deal treacherously against the wife of his youth. 2:16 For YHWH, the Elohim of Israel, saith that he hateth putting away: for one covereth violence with his garment, saith YHWH of hosts: therefore take heed to your spirit, that ye deal not treacherously. 2:17 Ye have wearied YHWH with your words. Yet ye say, Wherein have we wearied him? When ye say, Every one that doeth evil is good in the sight of YHWH, and he delighteth in them; or, Where is the Elohim of judgment? ~RNKJV, The book of Malachi Quote: 37:7 Rest in YHWH, and wait patiently for him: fret not thyself because of him who prospereth in his way, because of the man who bringeth wicked devices to pass. 37:8 Cease from anger, and forsake wrath: fret not thyself in any wise to do evil. 37:9 For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon YHWH, they shall inherit the earth. 37:10 For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be. ~RNKJV, The book of Psalms
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Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:45 pm
Thank you everyone for what you have said. Thank you Metal Wallflower for your insight. It was greatly appreciated. Also to faithful quenga, I have not talked to my parents for almost three weeks now and it has been peaceful. No more waking up at night screaming or crying. I love it.
I know that forgiveness is something all Christians are called to do. Sometimes I find it amazing just how much they are able to forgive. Sometimes what I find is even more amazing is who we blame. Somehow the victim always seems to blame themselves for what happened to them. They feel like they brought it on themselves or caused it. I had some insight into this by the strangest thing. There was a doctor talking about people with weight problems. He said that our self esteem is set by the age of eight. If we are taught that we aren't valued by then we think less of ourselves when we get older. It made me think about how we are taught to handle the violence or wrongs done to us as adults. My mom taught me that it was no big deal or that it was ok because the other person had a good reason to do what they did. In other words, I was not important. The other people held more value.
Here is the catch, how can we believe that Christ loves us and cares for us when we have so little self worth? I am learning that I'm somebody and my opinion counts. I am worth loving because Christ loves me and would have died on the cross even if I was the only person on earth. The same holds true for anyone who reads this. We shouldn't think less of ourselves. We should place the blame where it belongs. It belongs to the people who commit horrible acts like rape or murder. And the forgiveness goes with that so that God can help us heal. Broken pieces can be turned into master pieces in God's hands.
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Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 9:11 pm
iamlost4ever Thank you everyone for what you have said. Thank you Metal Wallflower for your insight. It was greatly appreciated. Also to faithful quenga, I have not talked to my parents for almost three weeks now and it has been peaceful. No more waking up at night screaming or crying. I love it. I know that forgiveness is something all Christians are called to do. Sometimes I find it amazing just how much they are able to forgive. Sometimes what I find is even more amazing is who we blame. Somehow the victim always seems to blame themselves for what happened to them. They feel like they brought it on themselves or caused it. I had some insight into this by the strangest thing. There was a doctor talking about people with weight problems. He said that our self esteem is set by the age of eight. If we are taught that we aren't valued by then we think less of ourselves when we get older. It made me think about how we are taught to handle the violence or wrongs done to us as adults. My mom taught me that it was no big deal or that it was ok because the other person had a good reason to do what they did. In other words, I was not important. The other people held more value. Here is the catch, how can we believe that Christ loves us and cares for us when we have so little self worth? I am learning that I'm somebody and my opinion counts. I am worth loving because Christ loves me and would have died on the cross even if I was the only person on earth. The same holds true for anyone who reads this. We shouldn't think less of ourselves. We should place the blame where it belongs. It belongs to the people who commit horrible acts like rape or murder. And the forgiveness goes with that so that God can help us heal. Broken pieces can be turned into master pieces in God's hands. My friend, Your situation and what you said about self worth and our Lord and Savior Jesus, and also about God being the potter and we are but the clay. It made me think of two things after reading it. 1-God tends to use broken things-people, to make His light and His Will work more for Him through those who He restores, and by people seeing us as an example of our faith, it may justbe the very thing which will bring others who are maybe as broken as well, closer to God thus fufilling our purpose and walk with Him. The 2nd thought was an old church hymn; "Oh how I love Jesus, oh how I love Jesus, oh how I love Jesus because He first loved me." The entire bases as to why God gave His only begotten to son to die for our sins on a cross and through Christ Jesus we can be saved and have ever lasting life, and best yet; by His stripes we are healed which means when we are called into heaven to be with our Lord we will have glorified bodies with no blemishes, or pain, or problems, or cares of our past earthly lives. That is something that every Christian should find as joy and comfort through any and all problems in this life. Plus as the apositile Paul once said 'Count it all joy, even when you fall into divers temptions.' (a brief paraphase - but I hope the message gets across right.) God bless you and yours my friend. Your brother in Christ, D. D.- Philip The Hawk
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:05 pm
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Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:44 pm
Still keeping you and yours in my prayers my friend.
Your brother,
Philip - Hawk
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