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 Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:31 pm
Well, what the ******** do you think about Karma?
Do you believe in the three fold law?
Do you believe in some multiple like the threefold law?
Do you think its only equal, what happens comes back?
Details, what do you think are the details about it, why do you think that is how it works, could you give detailed descriptions of your experiences that happen to support your idea.
Personally, I believe in Karma for a lack of a better word. I believe that to get anything you do have to 'give' something, but I do not think it has to be the same, or even similar to what ever you got. I do believe though that the significance has to be equal.
Do you think Karma can/does follow you through your life/lives(reincarnation cycle)?
Do you not believe in Karma, can you elaborate your post so that I can't really question it and it seems like a decent contribution to this topic?
What do you think enforces Karma?
If you believe in Karma, why can't it not work all the time?
If you don't believe in it, why can't it work sometimes?
Et cetera...basically, universal law, and enforcement of fairness...what the ******** do you think about it?
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Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:23 pm
Dorian Requiem Do you not believe in Karma, can you elaborate your post so that I can't really question it and it seems like a decent contribution to this topic? lol Do I believe in Karma as a cosmic force? Not on any level. I just believe that if you piss off enough people and burn enough bridges that on the average it will come back to bite you in the a**. There's also a potential of a Butterfly Effect coming back to bite you for some small misdeed in a way that could be interpreted as Karma. In short, you'll likely pay for grossly "evil" actions, but the small ones will probably leave you unscathed. If Karma exists as a cosmic force, it is in the sense of Hinduism. Not that threefold law of Wicca. -.-
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The Resurrection Vice Captain
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Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:46 pm
hmm, my opinion
on karma- I think that karma is what people pretty much use to explain certain aspects of the flow of life. I think that it may be possible, but even if so, it is only one facet of your being. I think, in essence, if life were a river, what people call karms would be the waves resulting from both the current and your personal splashes. I think that if you swim against the waves hard enough, you can overcome current (obviously, some waves are easier than others, based on your actions).
I think that people use something like karma to try to rationalize and simplify the natural flow of life. In math terms they are trying to make the equation y=mx+b out of y = sdf+d*rg/xd+s+dsd+hyuik+o*j*g+s+n/km, you know what I mean? if you don't throw in some exponents and constants everywhere.
I personally don't put too much thought into karma other than a passing fancy. Like destiny, to a certain extent, I don't care about either one. I don't do what I do to get to the ending, I do it so that I move forward.
the 3fold law- is that where everything you do comes back three fold? for me personally, I think that if anything, it is more of an equivalent exchange thing mixed with some chaos theory (which sucks, because every time I say equivalent exchange now, everyone says "oh oh, FMA FMA" ... jerks, nah don't get me wrong, I'm an FMA fan myself)
I think that no one is guaranteed to pay the full consequences for their actions, but there is still a full consequence/reaction. Even if it is on the other side of the universe, there is an equivalent exchange.
As for the multiples... maybe 7x, nah, 4x, even better 0x (get it 7, 4, 0? ugh, look at my avi name)
I think in a way, you could say it is equal, but not necessarily on terms that we can comprehend. There is usually more to the value of somethings than merely what we can comprehend.
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hmm, that is an interesting way to look at it, you have some good points, too! I can see where you come from.
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hmm, I'd think that the Karma aspect, much like fate, hope, will, soul, and everything else that I'm guessing could compromise a person would probably follow them wherever they go. Honestly though, I really don't know.
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I dunno, maybe if you explain a bit more, maybe I could
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I believe that if there is such a thing as karma, it is enforced by a natural order. (something else, let's say that there are magical little creatures about that, well, have magical little powers. I'd think that they can change things like luck, etc. which would indirectly affect karma) which reminds me, I would think that other people, if they do certain types of actions, can affect your karma as well most likely.
For example, let's take Resurrection and make him a typical joe [places typical joe hat on his head], ok, now let's blast him with super-mutagenic electromagnetic gamma radiation [BZZZ!], and now he is a super hero. I think by affecting his status or whatever you call it, I have thus changed his path (even if it was meant to be changed), and thus, his karma and such would be affected. Just remember, I still basically think that karma is our rationalization of what we think is to come.
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as for why it can and cannot work sometimes, I still see the "life as a river" scenario. For different circumstances, you might be a different type of swimer. in some cases, you can easily swim upstream; in others, you are still going downstream no matter how hard you struggle. I think that people need to explain it rather than accepting it as the behavior of the river.
well, I don't think fairness always is enforced, probably never is, really, in the grand scheme. As for universal law, I think that love is universal, so is light and dark. much past that, I get back into uncertainty with a big case of the "coulda, shoulda, woulda"s with a side of "maybe"
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Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:13 pm
Dorian Requiem Well, what the ******** do you think about Karma? Yes, my Actions have consequence's. Quote: Do you believe in the three fold law? The one that Wiccans follow that isn't what Karma is, and also breaks all laws of Entropy? Quote: Do you believe in some multiple like the threefold law? Do you think its only equal, what happens comes back? Neither of these have anything to do with Karma. Karma is a sum of all that an individual has done, is currently doing and will do. The results or "fruits" of actions are called karma-phala. Karma is not about retribution, vengeance, punishment or reward, karma simply deals with what is. The effects of all deeds actively create past, present and future experiences, thus making one responsible for one's own life, and the pain and joy it brings to others. In religions that incorporate reincarnation, karma extends through one's present life and all past and future lives as well. It is cumulative. Karma is not "What goes around comes around" , but rather " What Is done(Cause) will Make Similar occurrence(effect)" Quote: Do you think Karma can/does follow you through your life/lives(reincarnation cycle)? See above for what Karma is, and why it obviously will "Follow"
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Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2007 10:07 pm
hmm, just noticed no one has mentioned anything about my post, which means that either it was inconsequential or too long/stupid to read
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Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:06 pm
Well, what the ******** do you think about Karma?
Karma: Generally, people who make dumb decisions will face consequences. Whether or not we do something "morally correct," and it's effects, unless it is known to have negative consequences, it shouldn't.
Do you believe in the three fold law?
Is this in reference to the Rule of Three? If that's the case, no. It is a Wiccan concept to believe that whatever good and evil you deal out in your life, it will be returned to you; threefold! It doesn't make logical sense to me, so I don't believe it. Why threefold? And why will it necessarily return to you? Not everyone is rewarded for their good or punished for their bad.
Do you believe in some multiple like the threefold law?
Absolutely not. Unless you mean, "If I hit someone in the face, chances are, there will be a negative outcome." Then yes. That seems like common knowledge to me.
Do you think its only equal, what happens comes back?
Depends. If I DO punch some guy in the face, he could come back with a lot of force, or perhaps, run away, coming back with no reaction at all. Now, if I do punch this guy, and my car breaks down two days later, I don't see how the two relate.
Personally, I believe in Karma for a lack of a better word. I believe that to get anything you do have to 'give' something, but I do not think it has to be the same, or even similar to what ever you got. I do believe though that the significance has to be equal.
"For every action, there is an opposite but equal reaction." I do believe without doing anything, we would die, and become inanimate objects. Without "giving" there is no "getting." Without eating, there is no growing. However, I don't necessarily feel that being bad will get us punished. It will, however, create a cascade of chain reactions throughout our existence.
Do you think Karma can/does follow you through your life/lives(reincarnation cycle)?
Not really. I don't feel there is a "good" or "bad." Things we do harm people, and make them feel bad. This in turn can make us feel bad, but not always. I personally just try to do my best because I don't know what comes after death. I want people to smile and be happy because we're all on the same ride.
Do you not believe in Karma, can you elaborate your post so that I can't really question it and it seems like a decent contribution to this topic?
I hope that I have done this.
What do you think enforces Karma?
Generally, as I said, for an action there is a reaction. Now the quote I was referring to is most commonly known as Newton's third law. However, I do believe that this "law" can be seen in a moral and social aspect as well. If I kill someone, I am likely to suffer for a great while afterwards, and very likely am I to be punished.
If you believe in Karma, why can't it not work all the time?
I believe (if Karma exists) that it will eventually catch up. Why it doesn't immediately react, I am not sure.
If you don't believe in it, why can't it work sometimes?
It's not that it doesn't work; I do believe it is a working concept. It is jsut that to me that I don't feel it is a divine concept. I think it is just generally a commonly accepted idea that if you do something ignorant, the results will be negative, and if you do something kind, the results will be positive. This however, does not always turn out. Sometimes we do kind things and don't get acknowledged for it. Sometimes we do bad things and go unpunished. I think that when this occurs, what we are feeling inside is most important.
Et cetera...basically, universal law, and enforcement of fairness...what the ******** do you think about it?
Why the ******** do you like to say ********? ********... gonk
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Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:07 pm
Azuren740 hmm, just noticed no one has mentioned anything about my post, which means that either it was inconsequential or too long/stupid to read To be honest, how it was formatted hurt my eyes. gonk
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Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:21 pm
Azuren740 I think, in essence, if life were a river, what people call karms would be the waves resulting from both the current and your personal splashes. I think that if you swim against the waves hard enough, you can overcome current (obviously, some waves are easier than others, based on your actions). I think you're getting at what I was thinking when I read the questions at the beginning of the topic. I don't believe in exact personal karma - I don't think that for every bit of bad energy a person puts out into the world, he or she will receive that exact amount back. I don't believe that because it seems so untrue. In fact, I think often that people who put out too much good energy into the world are punished for it, like Jesus, or Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. Both were undeniably workers for good, but both received early and tragic deaths. So I can't believe that a person will "get what he gives" because what I see contradicts it. However, I do believe that there is some sort of a "societal karma" - I think a society focused around good ideas, putting out more good karma than bad, will bring happiness to its members, but a society caught up in bad energy and negativity will inevitably bring unhappiness. It doesn't matter so much if an individual differs; like what you said, I think it's like swimming against the current. Maybe with enough personal effort, a bad man in a good society could bring an equal amount of bad things on himself, or maybe a good man in a bad society could be karmically successful, but it would take much more work. This is why I think people who decide to be determinedly moral in an immoral society are persecuted - take the earlier examples if you want. I feel stupid compared to everyone in here. I hope that wasn't totally moronic.
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The Resurrection Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:32 am
Capegio I feel stupid compared to everyone in here. I hope that wasn't totally moronic. Just relax, it's pointless to compare yourself to everyone else. Just focus on enjoying yourself.
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:23 pm
I believe in the Occult maxim of like attracts like. If you're a douchebag and cause suffering to others then your life will be full of suffering. If you're a generally "good" person and only do pleasant things for others then prosperity comes to you.
Naturally no matter what we do we will be hurting someone somewhere in some way. Makes me think of Chaos Effect. The decider is intention. If the intention to hurt someone isn't there then it is effectively out of your hands and falls to the Universe.
Just the way I see things based on experiences I've had.
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 9:56 am
Hmm. Reading all these responses has really made me question what I do/don't believe. I did believe in the Law of Three (please don't eat me!), but now I'm not entirely sure. Fore example, this past summer my great-uncle, who is 80 years old, tried to get in my pants. Nothing happened to him. Not one thing, and here I'm stuck hearing his voice in my head talking about my boobs, when I did nothing to provoke such a thing.
Really makes me wonder "hmm, if karma is real, I must have been one sick individual in a past life to have this happen to me, and my god he must have been a saint to go unpunished for it". Of course, then you get into the whole reincarnation bit, and if karma is real then naturally that energy will come back to him eventually. Which completely goes against society's need for instant gratification...
Anyway, enough rambling. To answer your question, yes I guess I do still believe in some kind of karma/threefold/reward & punishment thing. Whether it be just a simple cause and effect or some cosmic force watching us all, I'm not sure. But in general, if you're an a*****e, someone will be an a*****e to you.
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 8:23 pm
Karma is cause and effect, not cosmic justice.
Everything you do causes thigns to happen. Accepting karma simply means that you acknowledge that you are responsible for all the things you do, and all the things that happen to you.
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Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:33 pm
Moonlite Symphony Karma is cause and effect, not cosmic justice.
Everything you do causes thigns to happen. Accepting karma simply means that you acknowledge that you are responsible for all the things you do, and all the things that happen to you. Exactly. Karma isn't inherently good or bad, it's simply action. Why the mention of Dharma? It's from the same types of doctrines, and sounds a lot like karma, but it's more a choice of living the Way of Higher Truths, wherein you would watch your actions, but to my knowledge it is only connected to karma through philosophy/theology, not directly related.
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Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 11:55 pm
Karma literally means 'action'. By scientific law action creates repercussion. So in that sense, Karma is very real.
I don't believe in the threefold law or any multiple of it. Nowhere else in nature would one wouldn't expect to see exactly three times (or any other multiple) of the repercussion for an action. I believe in the law of unintended consequences. We can't know all of the far-reaching effects of our actions.
In a sense, I believe the repercussion is equal to the original act.
For instance, what your actions imply to others socially may not be apparent to you. So when a backlash occurs because of ill-thought out statements or actions, you may think it is many times worse than the original offense. That is only because you have misjudged the intensity of the offense, or how many people you have offended.
What comes to you is a result of nature. I know sometimes things that are considered bad happen to people who are innocent of its cause. Karma (Action) is how they deal with it based on their past actions and training.
Karma also includes what you learn from those experiences. Not everything is bad about a bad experience. Valuable lessons can be taken from most any unfortunate instance, and this helps to avoid incurring harmful Karma in the future.
When you react badly when something has harmed you, instead of learning what you can from it, the repercussions are on your own head. You deserved them.
If it is true that we reincarnate, and it is also true that some remnant of memory, however subconscious, remains, then Karma must follow the individual into the new life (through the remembered tendencies of the previous life).
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 7:08 am
I just wanted to point out that dharma has nothing to do with this conversation. Dharma is the teaching of the buddha.
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