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The stigma against medication.

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Llelwyn

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 11:43 pm


This is the post that really prompted this line of thought for me... it had been roiling around in my mind for some while, but this finally brought it out.

WayfarerStrife
Ha ... quite true ... to give chemicals to someone who has problems thinking isn't really a solution ... we should correct the view first ... if the person claims the earth is flat, we have to show that person that the earth is round, instead of forcing medicine into him or her ... sweatdrop


There are times when medications will help people think more clearly. Forcing anyone to take medication is wrong, but I would encourage people who are having problems dealing with their illnesses on their own to get into some psychotherapy and potentially consider some medication. If you have something that you can take that will make your brain function normally or at least BETTER, that will drastically decrease your suffering, I don't see the point in not taking it.

For a while there was this idea that medication could fix anything like some sort of magic spell... there has been a violent swing away from that idea in recent years to the point of view that medication is a dangerous and almost amoral last resort of the weak of will. People seem to think that taking medication is just putting more money into the pockets of the government, the drug companies, and the doctors (that last is blatantly untrue... the docs don't get a cut of the profits on medications they prescribe).

If you had a serious infection, would you wait until it was close to killing you to get some antibiotics? By then it could be too late.

I'm not saying that meds are a silver bullet and they will instantly "cure" you or fix everything... but they can really help. I don't think that either point of view, the "magic cure" or the "amoral crutch" is correct. I believe that we should seek the middle way in this, and understand that medications can be a tool, a very useful one, but when taken alone, they generally will not be very effective for long, and they won't be nearly as effective as medication taken in combination with therapy, which has been shown by studies to be far FAR more helpful.

So... what are your opinions? Have you encountered this attitude? Where do you, personally, stand on the issue?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:16 am


I would have to say that I too stand on the middle ground. I don't believe that just taking meds is going to really help, but it can help increase the benefits of another treatment. For example, when I was going to therapy the meds helped put me in a better mind set to really understand and get the full benefits out of therapy. Just doing one is not as good as both. That's just my opinion.

hickinbottom


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:16 pm


Well, my views on the subject stem from personal experience, so I can't help but be a little biased.

I found that when I was suffering from my illness particularly badly, I wasn't capable of seeing beyond my present experiences and trying to help myself. Medications allow that- they remove some of the fog of depression, but they don't magically cure anyone. I found them necessary, and still do. On the other hand, hopefully I'll reach the point someday where I can avoid depression without medication.

That being said- medication and therapy/selfhelp do treat different things. Medication aids the chemical causes of depression, and if you don't have clinical depression, they aren't going to do you any good. Therapy might not be able to overcome the chemical nature of the brain in all cases, but it does overwhelming good for those whose problems are related to their situation or their personality, and is in almost all cases a comfort.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 6:49 pm


Llelwyn
I would encourage people who are having problems dealing with their illnesses on their own to get into some psychotherapy and potentially consider some medication. [...] When taken alone, they generally will not be very effective for long, and they won't be nearly as effective as medication taken in combination with therapy, which has been shown by studies to be far FAR more helpful.


I believe it depends on the illness. Schizophrenia, for example is a biologically-based illness that is often treated successfully with medication alone. Therapy may not help Schizophrenics at all. In fact, insight-oriented psychotherapy has been proven to actually be harmful to Schizophrenics!

Doctrix
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:42 pm


Personally, I'm not overly liking the idea of taking medications, however, with the gola of getting better in sight...I do encourage people to get help. But this is me. I've been through months of Therapy before even considering the medications. I am having problems with it now, but I won't stop taking it because I feel like I am reverting to the original problem. I still believe each person should decide for themselves, unless the are absolutely unable to make a fully thought out and informed decision.
PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 6:47 pm


[Kudzu]
Llelwyn
I would encourage people who are having problems dealing with their illnesses on their own to get into some psychotherapy and potentially consider some medication. [...] When taken alone, they generally will not be very effective for long, and they won't be nearly as effective as medication taken in combination with therapy, which has been shown by studies to be far FAR more helpful.


I believe it depends on the illness. Schizophrenia, for example is a biologically-based illness that is often treated successfully with medication alone. Therapy may not help Schizophrenics at all. In fact, insight-oriented psychotherapy has been proven to actually be harmful to Schizophrenics!
Interesting! That's very interesting.

Llelwyn

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Mujouken Aijou

PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:42 pm


My feeling is meds work for some and not for others. I personally cant/wont take them for several reasons. The first is that I am a mother of 4 and the potential for bad side effects is too great. I cannot afford to be unable to function wether physically or mentally. The second one people will probably flame me for, but its the truth. I dont believe in birth control as it is against my religion. Therefore I could become pregnant at any time. Many of those medications can cause abortion if you are pregnant and that risk for me is too great. I was prescribed an anti-anxiety medication (cant recall which one) and I went so far as to fill it. For some reason couldnt bring myself ot take any. I found out that same week I was pregnant with my second child. The label warned that taking that medication during pregnancy would, not might, WOULD terminate a pregnancy. If I had gone through with it I would be without one of my beautiful children today. As I said, I know they can and DO help millions of people, but I have chosen to try other therapies and self-help for my condition.
PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:45 pm


Well I think with the issue of medication it really does vary person by person. So my opinion in the greater scheme of things for people are that they must seek advice from others such as family, friends, of any medical professional, then they must also take their own feelings into consideration.

I think sometimes people will just take medication because someone else says so, people need to consider their own feelings and thoughts, their gut instinct so to speak.

I do agree and love the opinion that if you use medication try and use some sort of therapy also. Human support and interaction cannot be places in a pill afterall wink

Dorg Endo


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 1:20 pm


Llelwyn
Kudzu
Schizophrenia, for example is a biologically-based illness that is often treated successfully with medication alone. Therapy may not help Schizophrenics at all. In fact, insight-oriented psychotherapy has been proven to actually be harmful to Schizophrenics!
Interesting! That's very interesting.


Isn't it, though? One study (of many) called "The Adverse Effects of Intensive Treatment of Chronic Schizophrenia," says "psychotherapies are analogous to pouring boiling oil into wounds because they ignore the chronic schizophrenic's particular vulnerability to over-stimulating relationships, intense negative affects, and pressures for rapid change." The book Surviving Schizophrenia by E. Fuller Torrey provides yet another colorful analogy, likening it to "directing a flood into a town already ravaged by a tornado."

And yet, despite copious amounts of proof, many medical professionals still prescripe psychotherapy to chronic Schizophrenics. Right now, at my provider, they've just instated a new rule requiring psychotherapy for everyone who receives medication services. So I've spent the last two days on the phone refusing to come to a psychotherapy appointment and demanding to speak to a supervisor so that I can get medication management without harmful therapy. The supervisor won't be in until Monday. Grr.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:25 pm


These comments piss me up the wall. Not because they are right/wrong in saying that medications do not work, but the way it was said. Such ignorance of neuroscience... which can't be helped, I guess razz This person here needs to correct his views rather than telling us to!

First - the good old giving chemicals crap. A lot of what the body does is chemistry. It's not as simple as adding chemical A to chemical B. It's like this long chain reaction of events. The magnitude of one reaction will release something, and this will react with something to produce a something... it goes on. The whole body is chemistry like this, including the brain. You give insulin to a diabetic. I don't really hear people saying "How is chemicals going to fix their problem?". It does. Something was broken in this chain reaction of um, reactions, and the broken link in the chain is fixed. Medication and drugs can and will change our thinking and behaviour. Have you ever watched someone pissed off their face? Or high on drugs?

My problem with medication is that we don't know exactly what chemical is missing from the brain in vairous disorders. Say in depression, they say that there is a relationship between low serotonin and high depression. But is the low serotonin causing the high depression? Or is the high depression causing the low serotonin? Probably the first, as anti deps seem to replenish serotonin, blah blah. But it works as soon as the drugs hit the brain, but a depression patient only feels better a month or so later, if the drug works. So, it has something to do with serotonin, but not serotonin alone.

Getting the serotonin in the brain is another hard part. You can't just eat serotonin. The drug has to cross the blood brain barrier. So you have to make something that will alter something in the brain, that will alter the production of serotonin (in the case of SSRI, the drug will inhibit an enzyme that will take the serotonin out of its receptor). Heck, depression can be caused by different things! In the future, I can see depression being split up into different disorders. Like anemia is.

The point is that we don't know much about mental illness, and the brain all together. So we are just guessing, hence meds don't always work. But they do somethimes.

Shinkei


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:12 pm


Shinkei
You can't just eat serotonin.


Ah, but you can eat 5-hydroxytryptophan... wink

But that's still not going to do much if you're retaking up too much serotonin into the presynaptic nerve. Which is where SSRIs come in. My stupid brain, however, thinks it can solve the problem by eating more tryptophan, which is why I end up with cravings even when I'm on an SSRI gonk *stabs brain with q-tip*
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:07 pm


I personally just don't like the idea of putting things in my body that also make me feel ill, really...for the first two weeks or so of my meds, I felt really sick to my stomach constantly, only with a temporary cure by constantly eating (which ended up making me feel sick as well sad )

Keakealani

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Miss Jopwie

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2005 5:06 pm


I went through years of cognitive therapy, but kept getting worse and worse.

But since I've been sticking to my meds, I'm so much better than I was before.

I have a few friends, who after years of medication, gradually stopped taking them and replaced them with 5HTP. They're doing fine now, and don't have to deal with yucky side effects
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:43 pm


What is 5HTP?

Prince Darialan

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