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The End of the U.S. Government System?

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Mikomi Katsura

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 8:52 pm


We all know that in the past, there haven't been really great government systems, or, well, even if they were great, many seemed to not give the people exactly what they have wanted, or need. And upon taking note of my generation, that alot of people seemed to like the idea of anarchy against our own U.S. government. You hear comments like, "our government sucks!" or "BUSH SUCKS!" or ... "U.S.A. sucks!" .... etc. etc. You get the point.

But ... Considering that alot of youth that are my age protest that U.S. has horrible government management, then what really is the flaw of government, if it sucks? Personally, I see some flaws, because this one rule about politics and government will always exist; government systems are never perfect. Here are several examples.

Example 1 - Let's take the Romans' government system, considered the most brilliant an ingenious political system of its day. And because of the fact that there were poor management amongst the council, and the way that laws were created was one of the main reasons that the Roman Empire had collapsed. Quote Everitt Anthony from the book, 'Cicero: the Life and Times of Rome's Greatest Politician', Chapter 1: 'Fault Lines', pages 10-11:

Quote:
The empire, the largest the western world had so far seen, was created more through inadvertence than design and presented Rome with a heavy and complicated administrative burden. This was partly because communications were slow and unreliable … The greatest underlying problem facing the Republic, however, lay at home in its system of governance. Rome was a state without most of the institutions needed to run a state. There was no permanent civil service except for a handful of officials at the Treasury; when politicians took office or went to govern a province they had to bring in their own people to help conduct business. The concept of the police force didn’t exist, which meant that the public spaces of the capital city were often hijacked by gangs of hooligans in the service of one interest of another. Soldiers in arms were absolutely forbidden to enter Rome, so all authorities could do was enforce law and order was to hire their own ruffians. The Republic was governed by the rule of law but did not operate a public prosecution service, and elected politicians acted as judges. Both in civil and criminal cases it was left to private individuals to bring suits ……. There were no penal system, and prisons were used for emergencies rather than for housing convicts …… The Republic became enormously rich on the spoils of the empire. So much so that from 167 BC Roman citizens in Italy no longer paid any personal taxes … All these things, in their various ways, were obstacles to effect administration. However, the constitution, which controlled the conduct of politics, was the Republic’s greatest weakness. Rome was an evolutionary society, not a revolutionary one…


Example 2 - Absolutism was considered the best way to govern the people around the time of King Louis the XIV. However, Absolutism went downhill, nonetheless. Though, the theory for it looks nice on paper. According to Thomas Hobbes, the author of 'Leviathan', says that people are naturally selfish, and therefore, one should give all their rights to a strong person, a leader. And, in exchange, the king will give the people protection. Err ... Big flaw in that. Kings are people too. Hobbes state that people are selfish. Therefore, the king maybe corrupted and won't look out for the interest of the people. So much for Divine Right as a ruler.

With those two examples in mind, these forms of government were taken into consideration by the United States' founding fathers, which eventually helped form a basis for our Democratic system (Actually our Democratic system refers to Constitutional Monarchy more, but there are flaws within that as well.) . They twisted and tweaked what was wrong about government systems in the past, and made a government for the people. All the governments in the past helped our government come to this point. Now, my questions are these:

~ Is there any flaws in our U.S. government system at all?
~ The downfall of the United States due to government system; Is it possible?
~ If the United States’ downfall occurs, predict what might happen. Will our system of government change then, or not?

Now, I command you, DISCUSS! mrgreen
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 9:00 pm


US now:Money=merit/status
US ideal=Skills, knowledge and additude=merit/status

Maximillian Shadowdrake


Mikomi Katsura

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 9:09 pm


With the U.S. only being concerned with money, do you see that as a flaw, or a good thing?
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 2:01 pm


I think that the biggest problem with an emphasis on money in american culture, is that it leads to individualism, and a loss of community.

_Pearl.

SneakyPope


Mikomi Katsura

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2007 4:28 pm


Well, for money, it kind of balances both ways, doesn't it? I mean, at least we're not only exporting for gold, but we're also getting imports from other countries so we're not relying solely on what we have in our own country. And money is usually defined as power in our country, so shouldn't we be glad that our country has a decent amount of power?

And I personally believe that the individualism does not start from the money and the loss of community; it's already embedded in our constitution and laws. We have natural laws that we have rights to abide by, and is given to us. With that kind of freedom, we're already lead to individualism by our own choices and preferences. Plus, on top of that, there's always going to be some kind of loss of community at some point, either at a small degree or large degree. Can you clarify on what you mean by that?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 9:56 pm


Okay, let's answer the questions.

Iksuinoyume
~ Is there any flaws in our U.S. government system at all?


First of all, I assume you mean "ARE there any..."

Of course there are flaws. One, as so many people have mentioned, is that we allow ourselves to be ruled by money. However, as any Randist like myself will tell you, money flows to those that have the skill to handle money. Therefore power goes with money to the best and the brightest. A government like Skybrarian was talking about would be a pure Marxist government, something that can only exist in the mind and arguably in SMALL (ten or less) groups of people. However, the main problem I see is the over clogging of the bureaucracy with bureaucrats (who should never be allowed in bureaucracy), and gross misinterpretation of and deviation from the Constitution of the United States of America as the Basis of American Government. With a bit of purification the government could get past it's problem. The only problem is that any purification that is done, especially through channels of violence, is less than permanant. Therefore it must be a social reform first, ne?

Iksuinoyume
~ The downfall of the United States due to government system; Is it possible?


Yes. It will happen, as a matter of fact. We fit perfectly on the Model of Empire. Try it sometime.

Iksuinoyume
~ If the United States’ downfall occurs, predict what might happen. Will our system of government change then, or not?


This one is a bit more tricky. The States will no doubt wish to become Sovereign in and of themseves, and diffrent forms of government will almost certainly arise. I should think that one or more state(s) will retain the most important parts of the United States government and refine the government. It seems likely that a cycle of nation-states similar to and based on the United States would occur. Each will start out seeming almost Utopian, and end up overclogged and needing purification. Just like the Chinese dynasties. Maybe we are the first American dynasty. Who knows for sure, though? I know I don't.

emperor_Hikaru

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