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 Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 9:24 am
We're all familiar with the all-too-ubiquitous 12-step support groups for addiction recovery. Alcoholics Anonymous, for example - my favorite little religious propaganda machine-slash-cult.
Their 12-step recovery program purports the idea that alcoholism is a disease, taking responsibility away from where it really belongs - on the alcoholic. Not to mention the fact that it instills in the alcoholic a sense of helplessness, which is truly a psychologically sickening (but rather clever) way to prepare someone to be brainwashed.
And what's the first thing they tell the alcoholic after he has admitted his helplessness? Right; that only a "higher power" can restore him to sanity. And to answer the all-too-common objection that the higher power can be anything the alcoholic chooses, I believe the standard meeting's recitation of the Lord's Prayer makes their platform pretty clear.
Add that to their simple principle that recovery is a "lifelong process" - thus keeping the alcoholic in the support group for life - and you have one of the greatest and longest-running coverups for government-sanctioned religion to date.
The topic for debate is this: is alcoholism really a disease? And is it really the answer to addiction recovery? If not, could this be why AA doesn't publish their yearly statistics?
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Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 9:30 am
Based on personal opinion and experience, although none of it with AA, I will recuse myself from this discussion.
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Cougar Draven Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:27 pm
Aww... that's the first stage of denial. That's why you need Apostaholics Anonymous.
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:29 pm
You know, Semper-I'm not sure it isn't a lifelong thing. Once you get to the point where you're really, truly addicted to something, it's life long. You don't just want that something-you need that something. In my case, that something is relatively harmless-diet Coke. (Yes, I'm actually addicted to diet Coke. It's because I had to kick an addiction to something else.)
As to forcing reliance on a higer power-I agree, that's bullshit. But here's the thing: maybe they do need something else. And it might be a disease (unless you can prove otherwise-I don't know). I'll admit-I, like Cougar, am kind of biased. In my experience, though, Alcholics Anonymous doesn't work. Neither does Al Anon. Sitting around talking about how much they hurt you and how much they continue to hurt you even if they're out of your life won't help you. Sitting around saying "Oh, woe is me! I spent five years of my life with an abusivre alcoholic husband! I'm never going to get those years back, and I'm not sure if or how I"m going to get past this!" Well, here's a hint-stop bitching about it. You're just forcing yourself to dwell on it.
Sorry, I got slightly off topic there.
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:39 pm
writercxvii Sitting around saying "Oh, woe is me! I spent five years of my life with an abusivre alcoholic husband! I'm never going to get those years back, and I'm not sure if or how I"m going to get past this!" Well, here's a hint-stop bitching about it. You're just forcing yourself to dwell on it.
Now, that's unfair. For a lot of people, talking about something makes it easier to work through it, even if that doesn't work for you. I know personally that talking about things that are bugging me helps. Then again, I don't have this *particular* problem.
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:08 pm
Drucillia writercxvii Sitting around saying "Oh, woe is me! I spent five years of my life with an abusivre alcoholic husband! I'm never going to get those years back, and I'm not sure if or how I"m going to get past this!" Well, here's a hint-stop bitching about it. You're just forcing yourself to dwell on it.
Now, that's unfair. For a lot of people, talking about something makes it easier to work through it, even if that doesn't work for you. I know personally that talking about things that are bugging me helps. Then again, I don't have this *particular* problem.
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:35 pm
I thought Al-Anon was short for Alcoholics Anonymous. What is it actually short for?
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:44 pm
SilverDratini I thought Al-Anon was short for Alcoholics Anonymous. What is it actually short for?
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Cougar Trollhammer Draven Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:33 pm
Look. I say it a lot. I'm not an alcoholic, because I don't go to meetings.
However, as Chuck says, "Then you're a drunk with problems." Also, another person I argue with says I'm still an alcoholic.
I personally, all joking aside, do not believe I am an alcoholic, since I do not think I "need " alcohol to surivive any given day. I drink, yes, but not to excess. I can stop drinking, anytime I want do. I just don't want to. I choose to drink, or not to drink.
My issues with AA are deep-seated, and refer to a close friend of mine, who is no longer among the living. He shouldn't have taken five years to get back on his feet, but AA kept him in the past when he should have looked to the future. Sometimes, I miss him, and as much as I blame the alcohol...I blame AA just as much. Maybe ******** it. Better to not dwell on it.
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Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:18 pm
Also, Dru, I'd like to add that Al-Anon uses a similiar twelve step program to control people and make them feel helpless about getting past this. Have you ever read one of their little book thigns? They're...stupid.
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Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:44 pm
writercxvii You know, Semper-I'm not sure it isn't a lifelong thing. Once you get to the point where you're really, truly addicted to something, it's life long. You don't just want that something-you need that something. In my case, that something is relatively harmless-diet Coke. (Yes, I'm actually addicted to diet Coke. It's because I had to kick an addiction to something else.) That's a rationalization that addicts will give for their self-indulgence. Actually, just about anything an addict says to promote the continuance of an addictive action is a rationalization. If they really want to quit, they'll do it, with or without AA. Besides, according to the last published statistics for AA, its success rate is only 5% - about the same as most people who try to quit on their own. So, lifelong or not, if you're addicted, you may as well not even go to the meetings.
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