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Tags: Hellsing, Alucard, vampires, anime, manga 

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Alucard's Guns: Just how long are these bloody things?

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Ophiuchus

PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 2:44 pm


Something bugged me ever since I saw Hellsing Ultimate in the museum.
Alucard's guns were the same size. I know the "official" props released were the same size, but they were only 30cm long.
In Hellsing (ANIME), the manga Volume 8 (and probably when first introduced too, I don't recall), the Jackal is quoted as being 39cm long.
The official props are therefore incorrect, but Hellsing Ultimate implies that because of this, BOTH guns are 39cm long...
In Hellsing (ANIME), Alucard's Casull is clearly shorter than Luke Valentine's sawn off M1 Garand, which has a rough length minus that bit of barrel of 40cm long, which means it's a smaller size than the Jackal, which would've been almost the same size.
In Hellsing (MANGA) Volume 8, there are TWO panels that show the guns easy to measure with a tape measure, and the Jackal is indeed bigger than the Casull, meaning that the two guns are a different scale.
I'm not sure what the source was, but I heard that the Casull was 29cm long, and made my prop ones ages ago to match this.
Due to my life being the sort where I worry over details on my costumes, I could not afford to be inaccurate.
If anyone knows what the source of the 29cm length for the Casull is, please post.
So, without knowing that source, we can but ASSUME it's the correct length, which leaves the following:
Hellsing (ANIME): Casull - 29cm, Jackal - 39cm
Hellsing (MANGA): Casull - 29cm, Jackal - 39cm
Hellsing ULTIMATE (OVA): Casull - 39cm, Jackal - 39cm

This begs the question of where the ultimate creators got the idea of making the Casull so big came from, and why they're both assumed by many sites now to be the same size. I mean, I heard Hirano checks up on the guys making ultimate. Didn't he go "waiiit, that gun's big."
Is there something in the Japanese volume 9 that states a measurement?
Was there EVER a source in Anime or Manga that stated the Casull's length?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:16 pm


This probably doesn't help, but are you positive that neither of the guns were foreshortened in the panels you say you measured them in? Anyway, my opinion is that the OVA is off.

Atomu



iStoleYurVamps

iStoleYurVamps


Trash Husband

PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:29 am


You notice that anything involving lenght/height/width/age, we always dissagree on at one point.....

P.S.: I gave up. Mabye around 39 cm for them both. In the manga,(or mabye he just does this...) the guns tend to be drawn at the same length. Thus I would go w/ the OVA version.
PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:40 am


I'll post up some scans tonight to show what I mean.

Ophiuchus


Ophiuchus

PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 3:26 pm


HERE WE GO.
Now, let's just start by saying Alucard specifically asked for Walter to make him "something bigger" than the Casull after seeing how it didn't hurt Anderson. Why would Walter then go and make a gun exactly the same size and merely change the ammunition used? It'd be much easier to just make custom ammunition for the Casull, should THAT have been the case.
For the longest time, the guns stated lengths were 29 and 39, though I can't state the source for the 29.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Ophiuchus/Evidence1.jpg
Exhibit A: The concept art for the Casull.
Look at the text for the side that doesnt have the slide. "10 Inch" - Guess how long 10 inches is in centimeters? Around 25 and a half. That leaves the space behind it for the firing mechanism and trigger, bringing it to 29.
This is however a weak point, so I move on to Exhibit B.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Ophiuchus/Evidence2.jpg
A shot that clearly shows a 41cm long gun being at least 25% longer than the gun in question. So it can't be 39, can it?
This means that for certain, in the -ANIME-, his gun IS infact 29cm.

Now onto the manga.
Exhibit C
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Ophiuchus/Evidence3.jpg
CLEARLY the black gun is larger than the white one by about 25% again.
If you round them up to 30 and 40, it becomes clear that one is 25% shorter. I did notice the Ejection port of the casull is on the wrong side in this picture, however, but that's a minor detail compared to length. Hirano spends like, a year making each manga, he'd know how to use a freakin' ruler to make them the same length.

Exhibit D
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Ophiuchus/Evidence4.jpg
It's almost obscured, but you can CLEARLY see the bottom of the Casull there. It's still shorter.

Therefore, the guns are clearly 29 and 39 in the -MANGA-

Not even gonna post the shot from the Ultimate OVA, but they're both the exact same size. so the -ULTIMATE- guns are both 39.

Proven?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:47 am


I can solve this puzzle in two words "Lazy Animators". And it is such a minor thing that Kouta Hirano himself probably missed it. Hell, a man who says things like "Her boobs will get bigger until they are planet sized" and "They're all cosmoguns that can hold a million rounds" Isn't going to worry about a mistake in gun size, besides, big guns are cool... Or something. *thinking naughty Alucard pickup lines*

KiyaraSabel



iStoleYurVamps

iStoleYurVamps


Trash Husband

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 1:23 am


furry1337otaku
big guns are cool... Or something. *thinking naughty Alucard pickup lines*


Don't we all?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:45 am


furry1337otaku
I can solve this puzzle in two words "Lazy Animators". And it is such a minor thing that Kouta Hirano himself probably missed it. Hell, a man who says things like "Her boobs will get bigger until they are planet sized" and "They're all cosmoguns that can hold a million rounds" Isn't going to worry about a mistake in gun size, besides, big guns are cool... Or something. *thinking naughty Alucard pickup lines*

It's possible that Hellsing Ultimate's animators were just lazy, but still.
I go for accuracy with my costumes. I have a 29-39 set of handmade guns, and when I saw ultimate I was like "wait, what? what happened to the size difference?" and so began my long quest to find PROOF that both guns are infact different sizes, for my own mind as much as anything else.
I'd say shots from the manga that Hirano himself did is proof enough.

Ophiuchus


biteysexgod

PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:41 pm


my vote is on the 29-39 measurements. having had to draw guns and varying objects in perspective in school, I can assure you that there may be some varyation here and there in the manga in length, but it is glaringly obvious that they are meant to be two different lengths, and that the Jackal is significantly larger than the cassul.

and Seras' magically inflating cup size is as much due to hirano's love of hentai as it is to the animators being sad, lonely little men locked in cubicles all day drawing the same images over and over.

Animators DO get lazy, very lazy in some cases, as can be noticed in many a pokemon cartoon as colors shift from scene to scene, and sometimes entire frames go missing.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:48 pm


furry1337otaku
I can solve this puzzle in two words "Lazy Animators". And it is such a minor thing that Kouta Hirano himself probably missed it. Hell, a man who says things like "Her boobs will get bigger until they are planet sized" and "They're all cosmoguns that can hold a million rounds" Isn't going to worry about a mistake in gun size, besides, big guns are cool... Or something. *thinking naughty Alucard pickup lines*
Thank you! Just what I was about to remind everyone. A lot of things in the series don't match up all the time when it comes to size. Call it lazy, call it an accident, it happens. I know the Jackal is 39 cm. It's a good guess the Casull about 29 cm. In any case, for cosplay just make the Casull shorter.

Ace of Death
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Deraga

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 2:50 pm


I belive that since in the amine and manga the casual is 29cm and the jackal is 39cm that, that would be the actual size. So that only means that the OVA is wrong!!!
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 7:11 pm


i have a conclusion. they are long.

Adrianna Ambrose


Elindarhya

Generous Entrepreneur

PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:09 am


Ophiuchus

Now onto the manga.
Exhibit C
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Ophiuchus/Evidence3.jpg
CLEARLY the black gun is larger than the white one by about 25% again.
If you round them up to 30 and 40, it becomes clear that one is 25% shorter. I did notice the Ejection port of the casull is on the wrong side in this picture, however, but that's a minor detail compared to length. Hirano spends like, a year making each manga, he'd know how to use a freakin' ruler to make them the same length.



Not meaning to refute you, but I would like to point out that the guns are, in fact, at different angles. Don't know how much you know about art, but that tends to mess with perception. Depending on the angle, something smaller can seem bigger and something bigger can seem smaller.

Now, that isn't to say they aren't different. When Walter made the Jackal, it was designed to be more powerful, so it stands to reason that its bigger.

Unfortunately, Hirano isn't what you could call consistent, and probably doesn't care, as long as it doesn't screw with the storyline. Now, if they had called him up and said, "Hey, we're making the guns the same size, and we just wanted to let you know it would make us have to insert Incognito, " he would have probably said something. Screamed, actually. But I digress.

Do what makes you happy. If you don't feel comfortable making them the same length, by all means, make the Casull smaller. No one is really going to care, so long as the cosplay is good.
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